So part of the text of the card Kinetic Looter in Chokepoint's deck is "The first time a hero card leaves play each turn, put it face-down in the villain play area."
My question is does a played one-shot enter and leave play for the purposes of this card?
Nope. One shots are played but they are not in the play area to leave play.
The "play area" seems to becoming more and more ambiguous. Are one-shots played in limbo?
Pretty much. If they are you could have a situation where Into the Stratosphere could put Rook City is Mine! back on top of the Chairman's deck through Ghostly Images coming out.
Source on this? I believe this is incorrect.
Take Akash for example. Her deck has many times where, due to order of actions, you can have multiple one-shots all at different stages of resolution trying to resolve. They are certainly in the villain play area as they are taking effect.
If you wanna create a whole new undefined area for one-shots to be played, I'd say thats a little obtuse
Is there a reason why this absolutely 100% cannot possibly be the case? I think it would be a rather cool interaction.
It should be in the fireside chats which I'll check. This was originally determined in alpha testing for the video game.
It has been confirmed while Mega Computer testing that One-Shots cannot be Into the Stratosphered. Also, if One-Shots are in play, they cannot leave play with Fixed Point, and I think it was there that we had the ruling that One-Shots aren’t in play.
From the fireside chats
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One-shots are not considered or counted as “cards in play.” That means Into the Stratosphere or Cedistic Dissonant cannot destroy one-shots that are currently being played.
Ok thanks Powerhound. You were right on the money all along.
I kind of wish there was a "resolution zone" to avoid confusion for newer players.
Thanks all. We beat Chokepoint pretty easily and I wanted to make sure we played that card correctly.
If they didn’t mean for Kinetic Looter to apply to one-shots, why didn’t they just say “the first time a hero card is destroyed?”
And if one-shots never enter or leave pay, can Buffer Overflow not prevent them?
It causes things like Mister Fixer's Tools to going face-down as well.
Or the plating cards from Omnitron-X.
To answer the other question I think the wording is meant to capture both a normal card play or card is put into play
That said, when Kismet has her talisman a one-shot Jinx currently being processed does add to her damage total - I forget what it's called but there's one that deals damage based on the number of Jinxes currently in play and it counts itself among that total. Something like that, anyway. I seem to recall it coming up on the forum before, aaaages ago…
It's in play while it resolves, but it never enters the play area (is my understanding of the situation).
You're right it did.
But we were wrong. It does not increase damage for itself.
I ran into headaches trying to resolve this card in a game against her as well. I have the feeling that there is a rewording of the card, or of the "play area" rules that can be written that will make it all feel less nebulous. Even if we do figure out the correct method for it's resolution, i do not feel it is one that lends itself to being immediately clear to the player without some rules digging.
Seems simple enough to me. The Play Area is where cards go that stay there for a while -- ongoings, equipment, Golems, etc.
When you play a one-shot, it goes right from your hand to the trash. It's an instant effect, so it doesn't officially go into the play area.
Not when you're dealing with a stack of effects. Infinitor is a prime example. You can't send cards to the trash right away because of cards that have multiple actions, which are interrupted by other actions. Even the app shows them entering the play area, even if they're not considered "in play."
There are also individual play areas - illustrated well by how it’s harder for Chokepoint to steal most Links than other kinds of equipment. When destroyed, many Links leave the villain or environment play area, not a hero play area, so Kinetic Looter can’t grab them.
Except Kinetic Looter says nothing about the hero play area, it just says "leaves play", so it doesn't matter where it currently is if it's a hero card leaving play… unless the wording has been changed since we saw the proofs (judging by the OP, no).
…
And looking at it we really should have seen that the way her (flipped) End of Turn destruction effect and Kinetic Looter interacted.
So does this imply that Surprise Shopping Trip doesn't trigger on one-shots? The trigger is on when "a card enters play". That would make it much less annoying/powerful.
I think that wording is just meant to capture a card being played normally or put into play from another affect. So this ruling should not prevent that damage.
Yeah, that wording shouldn't matter. Otherwise, Omnitron-X and Super Scientific Tachyon would have issues putting their one-shots into play.
Err…right then, not Kinetic Looter - the other one. Chokepoint definitely had some card that destroyed equipment and referred to cards leaving the hero play area while I had a Cortex Hyperstimulator in front of her.
I personally find it incredibly confusing that if I "Play" a one-shot card, It is not considered to be "in my play area". Especially since the rules are clear on the fact that until it is resolved, it remains on the table in front of you before being moved to the trash.
It seems a simpler change would be for Kinetic Looter to read "The first time a hero card other than a one-shot leaves play each turn..." if that is the intention.
The mental gymnastics required to interact with one-shots are amazing.
They enter play, but are not in play after they enter play, nor do they leave play.
Basically we have a ruling that card effects will never count One-Shot cards as cards in play.
Because that makes a lot more sense than saying that One Shot cards that enter play never enter play.