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Dark Watch

237 posts · 22415 views · started 2013-10-03 22:15 UTC
EV
EvanDan55
2013-10-03 22:15 UTC
#1

Let's talk about this. Setback's group affiliation lists him as being a part of something called the Dark Watch. But he's the only one. So, is he just a part of a team that none of the other heroes are a part of as of now? The name invokes the idea of a magic-based team (connection made thanks to Justice League Dark), so on that note, I'd be thinking Nightmist is a member. But she doesn't have a listed affiliation. So, it's entirely possible she's a member.

Playtesters: I guess our only other options would be that [REDACTED] and [RE]-[DACTED] would be members, but even if they were both Dark Watch members, that'd be a small team of three. 

Any more thoughts? Is Setback just a one-man team? I'm not saying this is for sure a magic based team--I'm just curious if Dark Watch IS a team.

CH
Christopher
2013-10-04 00:35 UTC
#2

Dark Watch IS a team.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-10-04 00:37 UTC
#3

And there we have it.  Question answered, nothing further to see here folks.

PY
Pydro
2013-10-04 00:44 UTC
#4

Actually, there is. Christopher didn't smoke bomb, which means he is still here…somewhere.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-10-04 00:46 UTC
#5

shhh. . . don't give it all away.

EV
EvanDan55
2013-10-04 01:28 UTC
#6

But I have so many more questions…

Such as: is it Rolex or Omega?

PY
Pydro
2013-10-04 01:31 UTC
#7

After daylight saving time, the Dark Watch is Setback.

EN
Envisioner
2013-10-04 01:37 UTC
#8

I don't think the team name suggests magic.  If anything, my guess would be that it's a more "street"-level team akin to the Marvel Knights, though that would leave me wondering why Expat and/or Fixer aren't in it.  Perhaps there will be promo versions of them that have joined the new team, and the same might happen with Nightmist, but just as likely we'll see at least two new heroes for it.

(With probably two more members of the Prime Wardens coming, and only a projected seven new heroes impending, even a very small Dark Watch would very nearly overshadow - yuk yuk, see what I did there...hey, at least I didn't say "eclipse" - the possibilities for new heroes that lack a team affiliation.  So perhaps the theme of the next expansion will resolve around how villain escalation forces previously independent heroes to team up for the sake of self-preservation and effectiveness against the rising tide of evil...the latter threat being very likely paid off in the final expansion.)

FO
Foote
2013-10-04 01:53 UTC
#9

There's only one more prime warden  

Whos to say the dark watch is a team of heros? Just a thought. 

EN
Envisioner
2013-10-04 01:57 UTC
#10

Going by the art of Silver Shadow, there's two, unless the ghostly figure is Nightmist.  But she doesn't list a team affiliation, and it really doesn't look like her (if anything it more nearly resembles Shu of the Ennead...perhaps he's on the other team, Foote?).

FO
Foote
2013-10-04 02:12 UTC
#11

That's the silver shadow the card name is referring to you're talking about, not a separate hero. 

CR
Craig
2013-10-04 02:48 UTC
#12

This is one I get to sit back and watch.

*attempts a smoke bomb*

*fizzles*

*leaps away embarrassingly*

KE
ketigid
2013-10-04 03:36 UTC
#13

Interesting… That would mean playtesters know about at least 2 (hero?) characters that has not been publicly revealed yet. But, all 5 Vengeance heroes are already revealed. Possibilities?

  1. Playtesters are already playtesting the next expansion after Vengeance! Huzzah.

  2. There is going to be 2 secret promo-heroes secretly shipping with Vengeance. It'll be a surprise.

  3. Those 2 characters are minor characters appearing only within other decks. Possbily environment deck.

  4. They are not hero characters! Gasp! Dark Watch is a Hero-Villain combo team. Who's their common enemy? Some Cosmic Entity?

RO
Ronway
2013-10-04 03:42 UTC
#14
  1. Went into the future to find out.
GR
grim88
2013-10-04 04:12 UTC
#15

Could be some more mini expansions

EN
Envisioner
2013-10-04 07:37 UTC
#16

It would kind of suck if members of a team were confined to mini-expansions.  Unity gets a pass because she's only an intern to the F# rather than a full member (except in the F6, which are an alternate future), but the Scholar is perfect...a complete oddball whose exclusion from the core game and its main expansions seems entirely appropriate.  Miss Information also seems to deserve her outsider status, while with Ambuscade it's distinctly questionable given that he's Haka's nemesis.

RE
Reckless
2013-10-04 08:01 UTC
#17

The guy was experimented on by Baron Blade.  Perhaps it's an elite group of Baron Blade mooks?  Just because he was affiliated with a group at one point doesn't mean he's still associated with them.

MA
Matchstickman
2013-10-04 11:30 UTC
#18

Except the Bios have a field for "Previous Affiliations", so Dark Watch would have to be a team of Baron Blade's mooks who Setback was still a part of, is he a part time hero and part time villain? Who would trust him?

NI
Nielzabub
2013-10-04 11:38 UTC
#19

It's possible we have some characters we know and love who are part of Dark Watch. How long did it take for Haka, Fanatic, and Tempest's bios to show that they were part of the Prime Wardens?

RE
Reckless
2013-10-04 14:41 UTC
#20

Ah.  That's what I get for not looking his bio over carefully.  My mistake!

PH
phantaskippy
2013-10-04 15:07 UTC
#21

We have plenty of future heroes to come, and a whole lot of storyline.  Dark Watch could be anything.

I think it is a group that realized that the only way to actually save the innocent people would be to eliminate all super powers, they travel back in time and destroy everything that causes superheroes and supervillains to exist.  A few remain in that world just to make sure that things stay the way they are.  They probably raise funds by calling on their past lives to sell us stories of a world that no longer exists.

That's why Christopher said Dark Watch IS a team, because they still exist, and he's one of the few who know about it.

 

This is obviously insane rambling and I have no evidence of any of this, so don't hurt me.

BY
byc
2013-10-04 15:38 UTC
#22

I really hope Dark Watch is just something Setback made up so not to stand out.

BE
Benhimself
2013-10-04 16:31 UTC
#23

Hmmm. Nightmist doesn't have a Group Affiliation listed, which is odd because a few other characters have "Group Affiliation: None." Maybe she's in the Dark Watch as well?

EV
EvanDan55
2013-10-04 16:33 UTC
#24

Whoa, hey, you can't just jump in here like that and expect to get away with your secret information. Get the hell back here.

Unfortunately, us playtesters have just about as much knowledge as the rest of you when it comes to Dark Watch.

I suppose the most likely scenario (given the extent of my knowledge) is that the members of Dark Watch are people we already know about who simply haven't been revealed to be members of the team, but if that's the case, then what does >G have to gain by concealing their identities? I mean sure, we know all of the members of the Prime Wardens, but that means nothing, since we have no idea how they met or why they decided to team up. If it was suddenly revealed that NightMist and Visionary (just random examples) were members of Dark Watch, I'd still be wondering "Okay… What do they do?"

So I'm still at square two on this. We have a name and one member.

CR
Craig
2013-10-04 16:36 UTC
#25

Secret information? I have none... *shifty eyes*

RO
Ronway
2013-10-04 16:38 UTC
#26

The Prime Wardens were formed with the primary focus to defeat Akash'Bhuta. Argent Adept is the only real obvious one as to why he is in it, everyone else I can't say. Though they all have an otherworldly vibe about them.

DP
dpt
2013-10-04 16:42 UTC
#27

Is there a place to read more about the origins of the Prime Wardens?

FO
Foote
2013-10-04 16:44 UTC
#28

Dark Watch...Dark Visionary? I see a connection here

RO
Ronway
2013-10-04 16:46 UTC
#29

Sadly there isn't. The only reason why I know about them forming to stop AB was one of the 3 times I got to meet Christopher. I had brought it up and that was one of the few straight foward things he has told me.

Curse those round about answers I keep getting! Adam does it too… Curse them all!

CR
Craig
2013-10-04 16:53 UTC
#30

It's things like this that make me hope for a Complete Guide to the History of the Multiverse when it's all finished. Art book, behind-the-scenes stories, backstories, and so on. Like, once the story has been told through the game, we can see the bigger picture the way they see it.

PY
Pydro
2013-10-04 17:15 UTC
#31

If Zelda could do it, so could SotM!

CR
Craig
2013-10-04 17:23 UTC
#32

Exactly. Interestingly enough, I have Hyrule Historia sitting on my shelf, and that was a large part of the inspiration for the idea.

EN
Envisioner
2013-10-05 08:45 UTC
#33

+100,000

KO
Koga
2013-10-14 03:51 UTC
#34

Hopefully they will continue with the comics after the game is complete.

MA
Matchstickman
2013-10-14 05:26 UTC
#35

Given that tactics is set years after the card game, I think it's fairly certain there's an extensive timeline planned that will (production permitting) come out in some form.

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-03 23:01 UTC
#36

Well then...

http://i.imgur.com/JgHslNw.jpg

DP
dpt
2013-12-04 00:20 UTC
#37

However, this is the promo Setback, which is presumably different from the standard Setback. Is the standard Setback from Vengeance ALSO a member of the Dark Watch?

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-04 00:27 UTC
#38

Given that the basic Bio for Setback is where we originally got the name Dark Watch from... I'm going to say "Yes".

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-04 01:05 UTC
#39

It seems that with the exception of AZ, the Dark Watch is made up of the more risky heroes of the multiverse. Fixer and Ex-Pat have enough threads devoted to them, that I think most people on the forums already know the risk involved with them, and Nightmist is reckless with her HP. Setback's whole stick is high risk, high reward. This is definitely a thematically interesting team.

FO
Foote
2013-12-04 01:47 UTC
#40
Is this real? The expat costume could seal that. 
 
 Holy chocolate covered Jesus. Bitter Strike. Good gravey. 
 
Aim should be very useful. Play gun, aim, play ammo and fire. Sounds like a nice rotation. 
Attunement is going to be interesting. It will really hurt her hand size and reduces the value of her amulet. However, a play style centered around Master of Magic would be very formidable. Anyone think she and Ra fused? She kinda has those Pharo eyes. Could just match the costume too I guess. 
 
Mitigate. I'm really looking forward to getting the first Setback down first before I give this any room in my brain. Plus, all Setback stuff is still off limits till live.
 
And as always, that art is killer! Nice job Adam. Fixer looks like a straight boss. 
 
Thematically, this doesn't look good for our heros. Are these timey wimey alternates? If these are main timeline folks, I don't think this dark watch would have sprung from happy times. Fixer obviously wasn't happy about getting stabbed in the chest. Nightmist have certainly become more in tune with the dark magics and Expat is geared for war and that scar looks bad. It all fits in more with Rook City grittiness. But where is Wraith in that picture? Gone perhaps. With the others. But where? Space!!!
 
/end
BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-04 03:10 UTC
#41

It seems more about a bunch of loners coming together.  People who were convinced that they had to handle things on their own finding new allies.  

For Expat, she's gotten a little less risky (aiming and using a sniper rifle rather than playing more cards and getting in close).

For Fixer, he looks liek he's learned a few harsh lessons, suffered for them, and come out stronger (but with some scars).

For Nightmist, its more about the long-term planning and less about the immediate sacrifice.

For Setback... His bio suggests that he doesn't really think about having "powers" so much as "stuff just happens".  Maybe this is an older Setback, who has learned that he can exert some control over things (or at least make sure that the bad parts happen only to him!)  

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-04 03:25 UTC
#42

I'm thinking Setback more or less founded the Dark Watch, and so his membership applies to both his versions, much as Argent is a Prime Warden even though we don't have his promo yet.

CH
Chaosmancer
2013-12-04 03:54 UTC
#43

I think, and have no time to look, that we saw Fixer getting that scar. Could it be when The Operative stabbed him? I know it looks huge but he might have needed an operation. Also the dragon tatoo is placed over it, remeberance of the student he let fall to the wayside? Really really cool stuff here, I can't wait. These will also be my first official promos I'll receive, no need to print from BGG :sunglasses:

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-04 07:52 UTC
#44

I'm assuming Dark Watch is formed later on in the timeline. I'd suspect his scar is coming from that massive stab he took from the Operative. Expatriette looks far more mature in her new picture, so I'm assuming she's in her late twenties by now. I feel like this is probably still in the main timeline.

@Foote: Wraith can't be on this team; she's already got her own!

I'm thinking each of them have suffered through something at this point and decided they were going to need help.

Expatriette and Mr. Fixer suffered massive injuries, with Expatriette getting almost shot to death on her incap side, and Fixer taking that massive stab wound we talked about. Both of them probably said "Well, I almost died on my own. Time to get some commrades."

Honestly, I'm guessing Setback really caused some serious trouble with the Freedom Five, maybe even ruining a huge plan of theirs at some point. I'm thinking he got too ashamed to keep working with them, and decided to throw away his old costume for this new one.

Nightmist, though, I'm not sure about. It's late over here and I'm having trouble remembering if something really awful happened to her. Insights on this?

And any insights as to Dark Watch's primary antagonist?

RO
Ronway
2013-12-04 08:02 UTC
#45

However, that is a image after the first fight with Citizen Dawn. She obviously has quite the career of being a solo character after that point. As she still dawns (i'm so cruel) the suit for awhile.

She has a curse for starters. Mechanically she deals herself a lot of damage, so one may guess that whenever she uses spells she also ttends to hurt herself thematically aswell.

Considering the new Promo Villains, I would say GloomWeaver and Spite.

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-04 08:18 UTC
#46

Her incap side is after the first fight? I need to brush up on my timeline knowledge. Still, I feel like her nature would drive her to continue her dangerous methods for a while still. I'm sure it wouldn't have been the last major injury she sustained.

Yeah, I agree that Nightmist already suffers tragedy on a daily basis with the curse. Hurting herself to use her powers is a pretty horrible way to live. Thematically, she's like Setback--but causing internal damage rather than external. I'm sure she's been through some horrible experiences dealing with her own dark magic.

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-04 12:44 UTC
#47

Nightmist's incap side appears to show her sealing herself on the wrong side of a dimensional breach...given how weird she looks in Dark Watch, I'm guessing she found a new way home from the Realm of Discord but was changed somewhat by the experience.

And yeah, Gloomweaver is totes the Dark Watch's antagonist, since he's the reason why Spite is back.  I'm imagining that the Watch's primary activity consists of battling upstart Gloomweaver cults, most of which never get past the chanting and knife-sharpening stage.  Kinda makes me wish there was a difficulty-1 "generic villain" deck to reflect such day-to-day battles.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-04 14:03 UTC
#48

A villain deck called "A day in the life" could be fun.

It would have to be set up to have some synergy with Rook City, so that you could go through a normal Rook City day and probably not make it.

I'm guessing the Dark Watch formed in response to the return of Spite, and Nightmist joins up because that silly Gloomweaver cult seems a bit more dangerous this time, and events seem connected.

I wish Setback's Bio gave us a bit more on him, I suppose his cards will, but that's February.

I'd assume Wraith is no longer a Rook City girl at this point, she wasn't born there, and she goes off and becomes part of an international super hero team, I doubt she is going to be on the scene very much.

Now Jack Donovan causing trouble could get her attention and bring her and the Freedom 5 to Rook City, but she isn't there for the leg work.  She'd get involved when it became a big deal.

Perhaps Setback was the first to stumble (literally) into the information that Spite or Gloomy are back, that seems like something that would happen to him.

He'd honestly be the best person ever to join an investigative team, as he'd frequently be in the exact right place, or the exact wrong place, and both would be useful in Rook CIty.

Man I would buy a dark watch comic series, and I don't read comics.

FO
Foote
2013-12-04 14:32 UTC
#49

I am very excited for Vengeance now more than ever. You KNOW there will be art clues abuntant related to the Dark Watch. Don't need to be a PT to guess that one!

BO
boxwood
2013-12-04 16:13 UTC
#50

The clue with x-pat's incapable side is that she isn't wearing an eye patch, the wound looks fresh and of course Dawn's rise symbol on thexwall

Also really excited for all of this, and I love that our Rook City characters are getting so much grittier.

Not that they needed it.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-04 16:21 UTC
#51

Ooooooooooooooooooh. So that would explain… OK. GOT IT.

BL
BlueHairedMeerkat
2013-12-04 16:27 UTC
#52

PLAYTESTERS. Grrr...

RO
Ronway
2013-12-04 16:40 UTC
#53

Hmm... I wonder which Dark Watch is the leader, if there is even one. I am more inclined to say Setback may be the leader. He does have the base power that helps his allies, unlike the rest of the Dark Watch.

Edit: Also the Dark Watch is introduced with Setback, which is what Argent Adept did with the Prime Wardens. Who else better to introduce a team with then the leader?

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-04 16:41 UTC
#54

I think it's kinda funny that Setback teamed up with Expatriette after his experience with Shock Rounds (I am assuming it's after since he is wearing his normal costume in Shock Rounds). 

She either straight up shot him in that card or his bad luck made the bullet hit him. Either way you'd think he would stay away from her. 

 

If Wraith isn't going to be in Dark Watch and Spite is going to be their main enemy, I do wish they had changed his nemesis for that incarnation. 

FO
Foote
2013-12-04 16:42 UTC
#55

evandan55 wrote:

Honestly, I'm guessing Setback really caused some serious trouble with the Freedom Five, maybe even ruining a huge plan of theirs at some point. I'm thinking he got too ashamed to keep working with them, and decided to throw away his old costume for this new one.

 

Ha. You might be on to something!

The color change is what gets me. Black/Yellow color pallete conjours two images for me. The struggle of bad luck/good luck, dark/light is the first and obviously thematically apt. The second is a caution sign, they are always black and yellow. The all black suit seems to be a clear warning to stay away from him, not just a "caution". 

TH
TheJayMann
2013-12-04 16:50 UTC
#56

I would like to think (and I may likely be wrong about this) that the Wraith is the leader of the Dark Watch, without being a member.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-04 16:53 UTC
#57

Roger, Mai- I mean, ALPHA LEADER. ... right...

RO
Ronway
2013-12-04 16:56 UTC
#58

Oh, so Wraith is that kind of leader. She wants to tell people what to do, but not be seen in public or be affiliated with them…

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-04 17:00 UTC
#59

Else the ruin her reputat- I mean, SECRET IDENTITY

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-04 18:49 UTC
#60

Yeah, that's directly what I was referring to. Probably, right?

Maybe Nightmist went full dark and has started using really bad magic? Her spells have turned red as well as her eyes–maybe she thought she'd have to use blood magic to compete with Spite/Gloomweaver's blood magic?

FO
Foote
2013-12-04 19:13 UTC
#61

It certinaly is a visual departure from her magic use depicted on Master of Magic. Green vs Red. 

By the way, @Christopher, you have such a way of making me want to look up and learn things. BLAST YOU!!! First I spend a week learning all about the history of alchemy, then egyptian mythos/history, and now this. I mean, have any of you looked up what "Attunement" actually is? 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attunement#Philosophy

The parrallels and conclusions about what her "Attunement" power says about her current state are interesting.

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-04 19:19 UTC
#62

It took me a minute to remember this, but Nightmist took the Rod of Anubis.  Maybe that's why her new incarnation looks Egyptian-esque.  Perhaps she's been through the underworld?

PY
Pydro
2013-12-04 19:35 UTC
#63

Is “watch” a noun or a verb?

RA
Rabit
2013-12-04 20:44 UTC
#64

Yes

 

:wink:

(And this is just me being sarcastic - I have no inside knowledge on this!)

PH
Phantom5613
2013-12-04 22:46 UTC
#65

Hey, I know I'm late to this party, but can somepne post the origination of these promos? This is the first I've seen them. Are they shipping with Vengeance, or what?

RO
Ronway
2013-12-04 22:51 UTC
#66

https://greaterthangames.com/content/the-end-of-the-year-brings-many-new-things

Edit: Wrong link, just noticed another update…

PY
Pydro
2013-12-04 22:52 UTC
#67

https://greaterthangames.com/content/the-end-of-the-year-brings-many-new-things

EDIT: ninjaed

RO
Ronway
2013-12-04 22:55 UTC
#68

Take that link wizard!

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-04 23:58 UTC
#69

The watch watches the watchers.  On a watch-cam.

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-05 00:33 UTC
#70

Does anyone else think that maybe Dark Visionary is involved with them, but isn't a member? They teased that she might become a villain later, or at least would betray the heroes. Maybe Dark Watch has fought Dark Visionary at some point? DV would certainly have an advantage over them. Sort of a Miss Information deal; DV knows how they think, how they fight, etc.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 01:01 UTC
#71

So has anyone else thought about the fact there are only four people in the Dark Watch team? The only other team of four is the Sentinels, but they're a team that shares a deck. Both the Freedom Five and the Prime Wardens have five players since that's the maximum number of players. So, is there a fifth unconfirmed member of Darkwatch?

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-05 01:06 UTC
#72

No.

Given that we've had both the Freedom Four and the Freedom Six I think numbers are just numbers.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-05 01:06 UTC
#73

There's also the Freedom Six... and there was the Freedom Four back in the day...

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 01:39 UTC
#74

Numbers may just be numbers with the storyline, but with the mechanics of the card game they usually aren't. We got introduced to the Freedom Five as a complete set of five. We knew they were four in the past, and we knew they would be six in an alternate future of some kind, but we got introduced to them as the five, same as the Wardens. It is very possible for Dark Watch to be just a team of four, I'm just saying that the pattern is there for a potential fifth member.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-05 01:45 UTC
#75

True... with Spite being a main enemy and maintaining the Wraith nemesis I would imagine she'd be the prime candidate for the fifth member... and bring her right back up to being the hero with the most promos again. We need a Wraith for every season. 

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-05 01:49 UTC
#76

We have two points for and two points against (five being a significant number in the Multiverse), that's not a pattern.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 01:52 UTC
#77

What are the two points against? The Sentinels is a self contained deck, and so even though they're a team, they're a pretty big exception. So far the only point against, is the Freedom six, which itself exists in an alternate future and is not part of the main timeline.

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-05 02:03 UTC
#78

That we have teams of 4 (Freedom Four, Dark Watch) and 6 (Freedom Six). We even have Unity as part of the Freedom Five (intern) making a sixth member.

I don't see why timesline would matter when your argument was about game mechanics.

 

Even if we don't have two point against, we only have two points for, and two is not a pattern.

There are two non-human heroes, does that mean all the next ones wont be?

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 02:15 UTC
#79

While speculating whether or not there's a fifth member of Darkwatch, we can't count them as a team of four. Two points for may not technically be a pattern, but the first two teams introduced had five members which matched the maximum amount of players, and that's not something that I think should be ignored. Unity is more of a sidekick to the Freedom Five than an actual member. I totally agree that there's a good chance that Darkwatch is just four people. All I'm trying to say is that there is a possibility of a fifth member.

 

Edit: The Freedom six wasn't an introduction to a completely brand new team, but an augmentation of a team that already existed in the past. This is also true of the Freedom Five, but again we the players were introduced to the team as the five and not the four.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-05 02:25 UTC
#80

Wow, it must be the moon or something, we are arguing everything tonight.

The Dark Watch may have more members, but I doubt it.  They are being released as a set, that would be like releasing 5 of the Freedom 6 and letting us wait for the last one.  The Freedom 5 all came in the original box, and the Freedom 6 were all released together, now we get 4 Dark Watch hero cards.  Maybe we'll get Prime Warden versions of each of the Wardens, or maybe not, who knows?

 

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-05 02:29 UTC
#81

NO!!!

RO
Ronway
2013-12-05 02:40 UTC
#82

It's not the moon! It's actually the north star that is causing all this.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 02:44 UTC
#83

Like everything else in the world, this is obviously Ronway's fault, and he's just trying to pass on blame to something else.

FO
Foote
2013-12-05 02:49 UTC
#84

Christopher pretty much spelled it out in the blog post. It's a 4 man team. Nothing out of the ordinary. 

Wraith still needed to be Spites nemesis symbol. You think that rivaly just died because he is dead? She just won't be the one to put him down a second time. 

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-05 03:03 UTC
#85

I don't know… if someone else is taking the fight to Spite in this arc, like if Dark Watch was indeed formed to take him and his Gloommaster out, then I think the Nemesis should have been updated for that particular arc. This doesn't mean the rivalry with Wraith just died… just that some other character would better fulfill the nemesis role in this particular story. It happens in comic books as well. 

It's a minor detail gripe that may not even be a gripe in gameplay… just something I would have like to have seen (and can easily house rule if it still bugs me later)

EV
EvanDan55
2013-12-05 03:56 UTC
#86

It seems likely that we'd get PW versions of each Warden, since we already know there's a PW Fanatic power and HP. It wouldn't be fair to the others if Fanatic got her own PW version and Adept, Haka, Tempest, and their friend got left out of the party! Though I assume they'll have different costumes, rather than all be wearing what they're wearing in Silver Shadow. Tempest looks like he's got a sword and a cape, so that seems like a new costume. Fanatic probably will change armor from being the Redeemer as well.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-05 04:15 UTC
#87

Jack is back from the dead, and you can bet dispatching the Dark Watch is just a means to a lot of ends, one of which is likely to be righting his defeat at the hands of the Wraith.  She doesn't have to be there to be his nemesis.

The North Star is weak.  Ronway is more like Ron Lane, and it is a dead end.

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-05 04:31 UTC
#88

Speaking of dispatching, who do we think dispatched Spite? Does The Wraith kill?

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 04:38 UTC
#89

Maybe the Wraith accidentally killed Spite, or failed to save him from falling off a giant building or into a vat of acid or something.

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-05 05:47 UTC
#90

She launches razors at people, I assume a few of her targets don't survive, and there are plenty of situations where killing him would have been the obvious choice.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-05 05:53 UTC
#91

Batman manages to wiggle out of the murder thing despite having many ways to kill people, and there are many obvious opportunities for him to kill the Joker. For all we know, Maya only hits people's weapons with her razors or causes non life threatening wounds. There's really no way to know with complete certainty. We know for a fact that Spite died, but that doesn't mean that Maya murdered him.

CH
Chaosmancer
2013-12-05 06:37 UTC
#92

I've been wondering about this as well. In  the "Wraith Killed him" corner though we do have some evidence.

 

She is, as far as I know, the only character ever shown seriously hurting him (the "unload" card of her deck whose name I cannot remember).

 

However, he is in his "normal" form at this point, and we know he eventually becomes "drug-wracked" and imprisoned in the Block... F.I.L.T.E.R. or K.N.Y.F.E. then become suspects (I hate anagram names so much when typing). Expat is a bounty hunter who has killed before (online bio) and operates in the same region, so she's a possible suspect. Heck, it could have even been The Chairman or the Operative who got sick of him ransacking their facilities, or just a bad luck meeting with someone like Plague Rat or who knows what.

GR
Greywind
2013-12-05 07:41 UTC
#93

It's an acronym. Not an anagram. Anagrams involve rearranging the letters.

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-05 09:23 UTC
#94

Regarding DW Fixer, I have an idea for why he appears younger.

I think that while he and the operative were fighting each other (See Charge and Undivided Attention), their blood mixed. We know that the fight was bloody (given the stabbing, bloody knuckles, and card artwork).  The massive scar doesn't appear to be from Undivided attention (in that it depicts the sword going through his shoulder), but it certainly seems plausible that it could be a result of that specific fight.  

Now, if their blood mixed, he might have gotten a dose of the chemical cocktail that keeps the Operative young, and gives her strength and enhanced recuperative abilities.  

This could explain why DW Fixer looks younger (or at least less grey) and beefier, in that the shared blood has given him a measure of his youth back.

This might explain the signifigance of the Dragon tattoo over the scar- it is the same design as the Operative has coiled around her arm.

If you want to get metaphysical, it could also explain the "bitter" portion of Bitter Strike, in that he's only alive because of his greatest enemy (and one that he might have prevented if he hadn't given up teaching when she needed it most...)

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-05 17:59 UTC
#95

Is anyone capable of providing a translation of the Kanji on Mr. Fixer's incap side?  Or, if it has already been done, could anyone point out where? 

EDIT: Free tanslator apps are not useful.  

There are two sets- the large set that starts with the character (according to my imperfect ability to translate) that means "End", and the small block of red characters underneath it.

DP
dpt
2013-12-05 21:10 UTC
#96

I'm not really competent, but I answered it here: https://greaterthangames.com/comment/36658#comment-36658. The top does read "Owari", The End, as you gussed. (I'm not clear how much this implies he is actually dead.)

I missed the other block. That is a signature block, and is written in katakana, one of the Japanese phonetic syllabries, the one typically used for foreign words. It reads "Adamu Rebotaro", i.e., Adam Rebottaro.

In addition to his Nemesis symbol (to fix/mend), the other Kanji I noticed on his cards is on the style cards; I believe they are names of the relevant animal in Japanese, although I haven't checked carefully.

FO
Foote
2013-12-05 21:45 UTC
#97

The Adamu Rebotaro thing was AWESOME! Man, it is such a shame stuff like that goes unoticed for the most part. 

LY
lynkfox
2013-12-06 05:08 UTC
#98

I posted this in the Promo thread in general, but thats gotten cluttered with rulings. So here

 

 

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-PeTPdq_7aO4/UqC5GUFcI3I/AAAAAAAAB0Y/qGbGVpQ3NTg/w467-h828-no/13+-+1

 

That is Dark Watch Fixer in progress at Origins 2013. I didnt post it earlier cause I got a hell of a stern look from Adam when he heard my phone click for a picture <grins>

 

However, I overheard him speaking to Christopher about it and he said the scar for where he got hit by the Operative ((I believe he was refering to Undivided Attention)) and that his beard will have less grey in it due to 'Coming back' -- now keep in mind this was almost 6 months ago, my memory may be hazy. But I am betting the Operative does kill him, and then he is droped into the Chairmans Lazarus Vats and returned to life.

LY
lynkfox
2013-12-06 05:08 UTC
#99

 

 

… I am totally adding that to the wiki

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-06 08:36 UTC
#100

Does the Chairman have Lazarus Vats?  I assumed that what we saw on Perfect Human Specimens was just a healing technology, not resurrecting the dead.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-06 09:12 UTC
#101

Depending on who's writing, the Lazarus pits in Batman were also only rumored to revive the dead. Ras used it to replenish his youth and keep himself from dying. It has been used to bring back people for the dead usually with mixed results, or that could just be the Red Hood movie.

GR
Greywind
2013-12-06 09:39 UTC
#102

The pits revive the dead. Jason Todd, Ra's, Talia, the Joker, Black Canary just to name a few. The Riddler conviced Ra's to let him use one to cure a brain tumor.

FO
Foote
2013-12-06 14:08 UTC
#103

Assuming the Vats indeed are what brought Fixer back, It is very plausable. That dragon though...I really want to know how that all fits in.

GR
Greywind
2013-12-06 14:25 UTC
#104

Iron Fist/Steel Dragon.?

CH
Christopher
2013-12-06 14:52 UTC
#105

The Chairman's vat things did not bring Mr. Fixer back.

FO
Foote
2013-12-06 15:05 UTC
#106

Dragon theory still in play! Time to go brush up on my chinese mythology now, see if I can't shoe horn in something to fit my foregone conclusion. Thats how research works right? College was such a good investment

Edit: After a quick search of terms and some cross references, information about Dragon mythology is pretty sparse outside of RPG stats lmao. However, there were some interesting things I noted. Some of the more powerful Dragons in early Chinese mythology (namely the Dragon Kings) could shapeshift into human form. There is also a dragon called ZhuYin with a serpents body and the head of a human (pictures of that are hillarious). 

Trying to directly find a Chinese Dragon of Life/Death (I really tried to shoe horn it man) proved fruitless. But, I did turn up something of note. That dragon I mentioned with a serpents body and human head? Get this. The opening and closing of his eye represented the rising and setting sun. Now, call me crazy, but I swear I just made a huge topic about Ra-Horus that linked the rising and setting sun as a metaphore for Ra's death and rebirth. And, even more interestingly, that Dragon's influence is also said to reach down into the underworld. 

You are all free to draw your own conclusions there. 

 

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-06 15:18 UTC
#107

If your looking to research accurate portrayals of Chinesse medecine being used to revive people from the dead, you might want to Check This Out!

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-06 18:40 UTC
#108

Given that Anna has said that Christopher has said (phew!) "That if you see Mr Fixer without his hat, he is dead"*, are we even sure he is alive? It does kinda look like he's in some kind of magical circle of lanterns.

 

*I have no idea what tone of voice Christopher said the previous sentence in, it could have been a joke

FO
Foote
2013-12-06 18:44 UTC
#109

What about the art for the card Meditation? You can see Fixer staring off into the mountains with his Hat off hanging on a treebrand in the foreground. Are we to say he is dead in that picture?

DR
Drakossozh
2013-12-06 18:45 UTC
#110

It can thus be inferred that there is something Fixer has to be 'back' from… which would support the theory of him having died and come back to life!

 

…Dragons. I say dragons.

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-06 19:06 UTC
#111

He still has it, he's just not wearing it.

But what do I know? I'm just repeating third party information here

FO
Foote
2013-12-06 19:10 UTC
#112

It's a fair point. I was jsut curious to see if anyone wanted to step to the plate and argue that the art for meditation is supposed to be more of a "metaphysical" representation than "physical". The art style is certainly a departue from the vast majority of the deck in that it looks more sureal than some of Adams other art (and yes I know calling something sureal in a comic book setting is rather odd, but hopefully I got across what I wanted)

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-06 19:18 UTC
#113

Wait. Are you telling me the not-real things I am looking at are not really not-real real? That they are not-real not-real?

I am so confused right now.

...

I think.

SI
Silverleaf
2013-12-06 19:19 UTC
#114

That's pretty much what I got. Fixer without hat = dead. Let me see if I can remember all this - no guarantee that this is 100% accurate, but this is how I remember it. 

Q: Is Golem Unity wearing Fixer's hat?

A: Yes.

Q: Why does she have it?

A: Because Fixer's dead. (Said in a way that very gently implies that I'm a tiny bit of an idiot.)

Q: So Fixer does die then?

A: Yes. And if you ever see him without his hat, that means he's dead.

Which of course ties in nicely with the art on the Fixer's incap side - incap Fixer is dead Fixer. 

 

MA
Matchstickman
2013-12-06 19:24 UTC
#115

Mr Fixer's incap side is just Mr Fixer's hat; so is the reverse true, if we see Mr Fixer's hat without Mr Fixer is it alive?

Is Golem Unity the hat come to life and taking over various machines?

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-06 19:39 UTC
#116

Original Fixer does happen to work insanely well with the Rod of Anubis.  That could be coincidence though. . .

FO
Foote
2013-12-06 20:17 UTC
#117

So…Mr Fixer = Frosty the Snowman?

And based on Silverleafs wonderful insight, I am very inclined to think that Mr Fixer is dead in the art of Meditation.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-06 20:17 UTC
#118

DW Fixer also works insanely well with the Rod of Anubis. Infact, I would go as far to say that every version of Fixer we may or may not recieve goes insanely well with the Rod of Anubis. So would Fixed Point and Plague Rat.

MT
Medic-Tank
2013-12-06 21:43 UTC
#119

I like the art reference on that one even thought I only noticed yesterday. I was surprised when I didn't see it mentionned. Of course I doubt Fixer can focus his Chi to heal cancer of repair his body since he has no healing cards, but the Iron Fist reference of fixer healing his chest wound with Chi would have been awesome. And as a side note I believe you meant Steel Serpent instead of Steel Dragon. Steel Dragon being the most awesome rock and roll band that never actually existed.

GR
Greywind
2013-12-07 01:52 UTC
#120

I wasn't a regular purveyor of IF books and I didn't check Marvel to be sure of his nemesisisis.

MT
Medic-Tank
2013-12-07 08:01 UTC
#121

You still were quite close, wouldn't have known exactly if I had not looked it up.

GR
Greywind
2013-12-07 08:58 UTC
#122

Avid reader/collector, and once upon a time I managed a specialty shop.

DO
Donner
2013-12-08 05:40 UTC
#123

So, is DW Fixer dead?

GR
Greywind
2013-12-08 06:15 UTC
#124

Could be undead.

TE
TeslaRoyale
2013-12-12 06:07 UTC
#125

I want to know what that R behind expat is. Also is it possible that Nightmist after a battle with Matriarch raided her wardrobe since they are about the same height and weight?

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-12 07:49 UTC
#126

The R is part of the sign on the RevoCorp building. Probably. It looks like a RE, and RevoCorp has been showing up a lot lately.

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-12 08:20 UTC
#127

By "a lot" he means "twice if you count this time".

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-12 08:27 UTC
#128

Twice more than it's appeared before!

TH
TheJayMann
2013-12-12 10:38 UTC
#129

That is well over 1,000,000,000,000% increase in appearances!

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-12 14:17 UTC
#130

Revo Corp is reportedly just off stage for Fixer's incapacitated side, but that is just a rumor.

Revo Corp was seen with a mysterious friend at the annual "Villain Initiative for Cooperation with Environments Annual Banquet and Awards Ceremony," Revo Corp refused to comment on whether it would follow its close personal Friend Pike Industrial Complex and attempt to make it as an Environment deck, or if it is content to remain a motivation and backstory.

Despite the hush hush nature of its involvement speculation is running rampant over the roll it will decide to play.

It did comment on the announcement that Mobile Defense Platform would make a successful crossover into becoming an environment deck, stating:  "We couldn't be prouder of MDP, making this transition from villain support to hosting its own environment will be an inspiration for future generations of both Villains and Environments, this is truly a Watershed moment for the relationship of Villains and Environments, and for this cooperative"  When asked about the news that Freedom Tower would also be an Environment deck Revo Corp stated it had no comment, but later submitted this official statement:  "It is disheartening to see the continued abuse of Environmental neutrality and independence by the Hero establishment.  It is increasingly clear that the Freedom Initiative is nothing more than an agent of oppression which has no respect for the independence of Environments, nor the creativity and ingenuity of non-traditional innovators like our illustrious friend Baron Blade."

CH
Chaosmancer
2013-12-12 16:20 UTC
#131

 

+1 for awesome

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-13 06:19 UTC
#132

The art on DWEP is nowhere near large enough for us to be sure that it's RevoCorp; we see an R and a little bit of something that may be an E.  RevoCorp is mentioned in one place, Parse's bio.  By the same token you could claim that the Wraith's bio proves that Riemenschneider University will play a major role in the storyline.  Heck, maybe that glowing neon sign belongs to the college and the "i" is just a burned-out bulb which we can't see in the pic.  (It is in Rook City after all.)

You keep using that %.  I do not think it means what you think it means.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-13 06:47 UTC
#133

99% sure it's the Revocorp building.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-13 06:59 UTC
#134

I think TheJayMann was purposefully misusing the % for comedic effect.

BL
BlueHairedMeerkat
2013-12-13 11:11 UTC
#135

Plus, what he said is technically correct...

FO
Foote
2013-12-13 16:04 UTC
#136

Keep in mind that speculation is just that. Speculation. It may not be RevoCorp, sure, thats fair to point out. On the same token though Envisioner, look at it again. Is it that much of a stretch to think that the overwhelmingly large "R" next to a much smaller capitol "E" with all the scafolding around, are all part of a large sign that says RevoCorp? RevoCorp seems to be important, even from Parse's bio you can get that feeling. These guys were studying parts of Omnitron at the moment he turned into Cosmitron. Now, I'll go out on a wild limb as say that Parse probably wasn't the only one working there at the time. If the Cosmitron event was what gave Parse superhuman mental abilities, is it possible that other co-workers underwent a similar transformation? This is all things I think about when trying to determin what role RevoCorp could play. Sniper ExPat standing on top of the RevoCorp building just reinforces my initial suspicions that RevoCorp

Why couldn't Riemenschneider U play a role?

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-13 16:54 UTC
#137

I'm wondering where DW Setback is.  He's a bit on fire, and sweating, and looks to be holding up some heavy rocks. 

My guess is that he's trying to get people out of volcano-related danger. 

 

So far the only volcano that we know of is the one on Insula Primalis (and we certainly know that it explodes).  To me, that suggests that he's trying to rescue a fellow hero or one of the Citizens of the Sun (since, as far as we know, there aren't any non-hero "normals" on the island).

 

So who's he trying to rescue?  

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-13 17:28 UTC
#138

It kind of reminds me of Marsquake, so it's possible that it's Mars...

RA
Rabit
2013-12-13 18:02 UTC
#139

EVERYBODY!

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-14 00:29 UTC
#140

Silly Setback, everyone knows the proper way to stop a Volcano is with a Grappling Hook.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-14 08:12 UTC
#141

... or with a bee.

TS
Theta_Sigma
2013-12-14 08:22 UTC
#142

It's more like a hornet, really

ZA
Zalrus9
2013-12-15 05:40 UTC
#143

Terribly sorry! I got here a little bit late, but I don't think Mr. Fixer without his hat really means he's dead. Remember, the back of his card says "Owari" meaning the end, but that doesn't nessicarily mean that he's dead. It could merely be that the Mr. Fixer that you know is dead. Who knows! 

 

Also, why does Nightmist have really Egyptian-looking makeup on her. Does that mean anything...?

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-15 05:52 UTC
#144

Well, she DID pick up the Rod of Anubis...

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-15 17:13 UTC
#145

So maybe the whole Dark Watch died.

Nightmist came back through the Rod, Fixer through the Chairman's stuff, Expat was raised by her mom, and Setback comes back by sheer luck.

In the underworld they find out about Gloomweaver and when they get back they end up finding each other (maybe one of them finds the others) and the Dark Watch comes into being to stop the Gloomweaver.

The Dark Watch and the style of their play being more build up for a bigger attack than steady play reflects the task the Dark Watch would have.

Following clues, investigating the remnants of the Cult, waiting for Gloomweaver's next attempt, and then striking to stop him.

Maybe they didn't all die, only theose in the know really know, but I think it works.

CH
Chaosmancer
2013-12-15 18:53 UTC
#146

 

Where are we getting this from anyways?

RO
Ronway
2013-12-15 19:07 UTC
#147

The flavor text on Rod of Anubis.

SI
Silverleaf
2013-12-15 19:33 UTC
#148

It does. Christopher himself told me. 

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-15 20:06 UTC
#149

Yeah, but how does he know?  Maybe Fixer was all like, "You can have my hat when you pry it from my cold dead hands," but then the team stunk so long that he finally got fed up and burned it, and now he doesn't have it.

 

ZA
Zalrus9
2013-12-15 20:30 UTC
#150

wait, then why doesn't he have his had in his Dark Watch incarnation? Is he hiding it somewhere?

RO
Ronway
2013-12-15 21:12 UTC
#151

Because he is a zombie! He has come back to eat the brains of all!

RO
Ronway
2013-12-15 21:35 UTC
#152

Proof DW Fixer is a zombie!

  • Zombies deal 3 melee damage when H=5. DW Fixer also deals 3 melee damage when H=5.
  • With Grease Monker Fist, Fixer can deal Fire or Infernal damage, who else does those damage? The greatest, most attractive cultist to ever walk the Multiverse, the Cursed Acolyte. What happens when one someone manages to destroy the might Cursed Acolyte? He comes back as a zombie!
  • The Profane Zealot has a DR of 1. Fixer has a DR of 1 with the Pipe Wrench. What happens when someone kills the Profane Zealot? He becomes a zombie!
  • The Chosen Disciple retrieves zombies from the trash and deals more damage because of it. Fixer can play Salvage yard to retrieve Equipment cards and also Overdrive, meaning he gets to deal more damage because of it. What happens when Chosen Disciple is destroyed? She turns into a zombie!
  • DW Fixer has a dragon tattoo on his chest. One may refer to dragons as being of the serpent persuasion. Snakes are of course serpents. What snake do we know about? Ophidia the Deciever, who works for GloomWeaver. GloomWeaver also happens to be a master of zombies!
  • Dw Fixer has his eyes covered, because he uses his super hearing and smell for the environment. What else has been known to rely on those same senses? Zombies!
  • If you drop off all letters in the Mister Fixer, besides a M, I, and E, you will be left with "MIE". Adding a Z and O before that and a B inbetween the M and I, you will get ZOMBIE!
  • DW Fixer is not wearing a shirt, zombies are also commonly found without shirts.
  • Fixer primarly fights using his hands. Zombies are also qutie fond of unarmed combat.
  • Fixer has been stabbed in the chest and is seen standing afterwards. Zombies can get stabbed into the chest and continue to stand.
PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-15 22:42 UTC
#153

Harry Walker, Oral Phrenologist

PH
Phantom5613
2013-12-16 01:58 UTC
#154

In referance to where DW Setback is, I think he's trying to save someone from a burnning bulding or something of the like.

As for DW Mr. Fixer, I've been wondering if what he's wearing is actually his Black Fist costume?

Also, am I the only person who repeatedly thinks of Darkwing Duck whenever I read 'DW'?

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-16 02:02 UTC
#155

No sir, you are not.

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-16 02:09 UTC
#156

Darkwatch Slim, when in trouble you call DW, Darkwatch Slim, Darkwatch, Darkwatch, Darkwatch Slim.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-16 15:03 UTC
#157

Ha. Most definitely not!! I'm waiting for a Gizmoduck Bunker or a Gizmoduck AZ to be part of Dark Watch!!

GR
Greywind
2013-12-16 15:53 UTC
#158

Let's get dangerous!

TS
Theta_Sigma
2013-12-17 04:40 UTC
#159

 

With AZ, you appear to be building the Rook City Irregulars team that people were suggesting on here a while ago.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-17 06:11 UTC
#160

I need to start to work on my Fearsome Five custom villain deck:

Negaduck, Megavolt, Quackerjack, Bushroot, and Liquidator. 

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-17 14:20 UTC
#161

We just ned to make a Dark Wing version of Sentinels.

You'd obviously have Dark Wing, Gosalyn and Launchpad, add in the Justice Ducks and I'd do a Sentinels style deck for the neighbors, can't remember their name.

It would be great, lots of potential for ridiculous quoting.

TH
TheJayMann
2013-12-17 14:25 UTC
#162

Will this also involve characters from the Negaverse?

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-17 15:47 UTC
#163

The Negaverse would make a killer expansion, with promo cards and everything.

KO
Koga
2013-12-17 21:57 UTC
#164

Not sure where it was speculated, but Setback and Expatriette may have some kind of relationship other than being on the same team.

Just got the new promos in the mail and on the back of Setback's card it shows him holding what looks to be an unconscious Expatriette. He's also on the back of Expatriette's card.

FO
Foote
2013-12-17 22:04 UTC
#165

Oh REALLY? 

The plot thickens indeed!

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 22:07 UTC
#166

Yeah, and he's CRYING over her. That's... odd for him, to say the least. I think they may actually be a thing.

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-17 22:10 UTC
#167

Why odd?  Think about it. IF they are an item, and DW Setback is all about trying to gain control of his powers, he could see her getting hurt as HIS fault.  IF he'd taken more risks, IF he'd kept his powers under control, IF he'd done something right, IF he hadn't screwed up AGAIN...

Even if it isn't true, that kind of doubt could eat at you.  Particulary if the one who got hurt (or killed) is the one you love.

 

FO
Foote
2013-12-17 22:12 UTC
#168

Could his crying be because they are an item, or because he might have caused whatever lead to her fall?

Are they both in DW costumes on the incapp sides? I ask because Im curious if this is the incident that makes Setback question himself as a hero, prompting the costume change.  

RO
Ronway
2013-12-17 22:14 UTC
#169

Expat's incap has her block an explosion that would of hit Setback. My thought is that happens right before Setback's incap, which is him holding her. So it could be a little bit of both.

 

Are they both in DW costumes on the incapp sides? I ask because Im curious if this is the incident that makes Setback question himself as a hero, prompting the costume change.  
Yes, yes they are.

 

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 22:17 UTC
#170

No, it's not odd in THIS scenario, but it's odd for Setback in general. He's like always happy.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-17 22:30 UTC
#171

Setback is human, so I don't see why it would be odd that he has other emotions other than happy.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 22:37 UTC
#172

Yeah, I guess. Just seems like it takes a lot to set him off. I mean, read his bio. A lot of really bad things happen, and he just kind of shrugs it off.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-17 22:39 UTC
#173

You guys got your cards already? Did you pick them up in person? 

Weren't they going out today?

PW
pwatson1974
2013-12-17 22:57 UTC
#174

Such is the power of the Ronway.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 23:01 UTC
#175

I'm not Ronway, but yeah. They just showed up in the mail today. I live in Kansas too, a whole state over. Paul is a badass.

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-17 23:18 UTC
#176

Think of it this way...

Setback is a happy-go-lucky, pretty easygoing guy.  He's learning how to be a hero, but its certainly not easy (Tachyon certainly didn't sound in his Bio like he was making everything go MORE smoothly!).  Maybe people are getting hurt because of him.

So we see DW Setback.  Note how he's not smiling anymore, or in a room full of explosives. This is a setback who's been through some pretty serious stuff- and even if he's an easygoing guy at heart, he's seen enough to get serious at times.

Now Expat is down, and she got hit protecting him.  He's supposed to be the one who takes the risks!  His power is entirely about keeping other people safer.  Her incap is getting hit (maybe killed).  Bear in mind that his incap doesn't show him PHYSICALLY hurt.  He's completely out of it because Expat is down.  That's grief so powerful that its incapacitiating.  My guess is that he feels like he just lost the love of his life- and it was ALL his fault.

 

 

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 23:20 UTC
#177

My thoughts exactly.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-17 23:21 UTC
#178

Kansas? Who would want to live in Kansas? Do you get a lot of tornadoes over there? Ever get transported to the land of Oz?

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-17 23:25 UTC
#179

Kansas is pretty good, actually. Good property values, with relatively low property costs.

Also, we haven't had a tornado in years.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-17 23:31 UTC
#180

...in this timeline...

SI
Silverleaf
2013-12-18 00:51 UTC
#181

Best thing about Kansas - sometimes a tornado comes and takes you away from Kansas. 

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-18 00:57 UTC
#182

>:(

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-18 01:46 UTC
#183

Best thing about Kansas was Dust In The Wind

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 01:49 UTC
#184

I personally prefer Carry on my Wayward Son.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-18 02:02 UTC
#185

Not gonna hate on that. 

GR
Greywind
2013-12-18 03:00 UTC
#186

It's actually Carry On Wayward Son.

AR
arenson9
2013-12-18 04:03 UTC
#187

 

Way I hear it, best thing about Kansas is that it's not Nebraska. At least, that's the word from people who've driven across Nebraska with all of it's pig farms.

AR
arenson9
2013-12-18 04:07 UTC
#188

Got the promos today, too. Woo! Got them just minutes before heading out for a regular Sentinels game that included Rabit, who brought his playtesting printouts from Vengeance, which means we were able to play a Dark Watch game. So! Much! Fun!

 

I played DW NightMist and really enjoyed using the new Attunement power to stack her deck.

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-18 04:12 UTC
#189

:( didn't get them. 

 

hmmm. I'm kinda regretting buying only the empty RC/IR box since I will probably end up getting decks for the new promos anyway and it will cost just about as much as the RC/IR expansion

NI
Nielzabub
2013-12-18 04:26 UTC
#190

I love DW Fixer. I've only played one game with DW Nightmist. She does have a great power, but I prefer the extra draw. It's harder to fuel the Amulet of the Elder Gods with Attunement.

BO
boxwood
2013-12-18 04:40 UTC
#191

I need to place that order by the end of the month. X-Pat and Setback have had their incapacitated sides detailed, can we hear about fixer and nightmist.

DR
Drakossozh
2013-12-18 04:59 UTC
#192

Will someone please please please post the new promos (backs, to be precise) already?

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 13:47 UTC
#193

I would, but I would need permission from the great powers.

FO
Foote
2013-12-18 13:56 UTC
#194

They will make it to BGG eventually

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-18 14:25 UTC
#195

Initial impressions after a couple of games with the promo heroes/villains:

DW Fixer: He's one of the heaviest hitters now, at the cost of some of his buildup.  Its pretty easy to hit multiple targets for 5-7 points, but you may have to skip turn if you really want a specific tool or style (or confer with teammates to find a sacrificial card).  It really helps to have him go first.  I found myself using tools that I normally kept in reserve (like the pipe wrench or tire iron) as one-shots.  Multiple target tools (crowbars/jack handle) are still phenomenal, but I found myself holding onto them until someone else had a card for me to eat, or a salvage yard.  Charge, while still good, was rarely played over a setup card or something for immediate consumption.

DW Nightmist:  You absolutely can't rely on the amulet.  It will drain her hand super fast, and she doesn't have an easy means to replenish.  If you try to play her like normal nightmist, it feels VERY weak.  If (instead) you shift focus to lesser-used relics like the book (to keep you supplied with spells), enlightenments, and use the amulet only as a last resort she's very fun to play.  the cost is that she's more vulnerable.  She feels less selfish, in some ways.  Normal Nightmist can often be the last one standing, and drag on a fight forever due to mistform, the amulet, and having a large hand.  DW nightmist has a harder time doing this (though she still can), but responds better to out of turn plays (since you know what you have coming up) and can coordinate better.    

DW Expat: I've had some great games and some frustrating ones.  Overall, I like the new power better.  You'll have frustrating moments when you don't have the gun you want, or you don't GET a gun for a while, or your favorite one gets destroyed.  But Aim allows you to setup even when you don't get a gun to start with, and makes the low-damage ones and hairtrigger reflexes more effective.  I found myself using it every other turn (unless I got a shotgun).  DW expat is an interesting example of a hero who gets FAR stronger with extra power usage.  If she is the last one standing and other people can allow power uses you can get some truly silly damage going with shock rounds, unloads, and RPG's.

 

Promo Gloomy- He's really tough.  things can go terribly wrong REALLY fast.  If a zombie comes out at the wrong moment, it can heal him or the pouch.  He hits hard.  You can get swarmed with extra targets if things get destroyed.  Its a rare situation where someone playing Unity needs to be at the absolute top of their game, since that many low-HP targets can equate to an army of cultists, zombies, pins, and relics.  We had one game (in the realm of discord, with Unity) where Gloomy managed to play 10 cards during the hero/environment.  

If you flip him, he starts doing massive AoE damage to everything.  If you can weather the storm, redirect damage or shut him down for a breather you'll have a better chance.  Or just throw everything at him and see who goes down first.  I'd tentatively call him a high 3...but it could easily be a 4.

 

Promo Spite- Its difficult to get ahead of the drugs.  Good Samaritans are a trap, since they give him an extra play, and with drugs out of the picture you're more likely to get something that destroys a victim or undoes your good work with a forced entry.  He doesn't heal as much, so you can power him down.  flip him and it becomes a brawl where he does more damage based on how many people are in the safehouse, though you have some ways of putting them at risk to help yourself.   It really, really helps to have some means of lowering/controlling his damage.  

PA
Paul
2013-12-18 15:08 UTC
#196

You can post the backs of the promos if you would like.

FO
Foote
2013-12-18 15:11 UTC
#197

That is EXACTLY what I wanted to hear from Gloomweaver.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 15:13 UTC
#198

Alrighty then, well here they are.

![ photo DWPromo_zps2e52e42f.png](upload://m5OfvVumai8FypLTEEuohymrTP2.jpeg)

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-18 15:30 UTC
#199

OMG Setback/Fixer/Nightmist have sick incaps.  Bury a card from the trash?  Bury the top card of the villain deck (or play the top of a hero deck), no problem.  Recycle one card from the villain trash every single round?  Can do.  This team would bury La Capitan.

 

Who is that guy on Fixer's?  He looks like a custom hero I saw once, but has he been on any other cards?

CM
cmschex
2013-12-18 16:09 UTC
#200

Ok, "The Rotting God" is offically my favorite title ever.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 16:22 UTC
#201

Getting ready to start my Barskin GloomWeaver again the Dark Watch battle, taking place in the Ruins of Atlantis, wish me luck!

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-18 16:27 UTC
#202

Good luck!  thats going to be a tough one!

TS
Theta_Sigma
2013-12-18 16:45 UTC
#203

Liking the flipped Spite there. 

FO
Foote
2013-12-18 17:20 UTC
#204

This is my question as well. And yes, he does look like a custom hero I saw on BGG a long time ago…

I have not seen him on any other cards…ever. 

What is going on in that picture? I can't quite tell.

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 17:31 UTC
#205

He has some kind of blade that he is stabbing into Fixer's chest, Fixer really should consider having that magnet removed.

FO
Foote
2013-12-18 17:37 UTC
#206

Last laugh on Mr Crimson, Fixer is presumably already dead! Was dead? Either way, he has the worst luck with getting stabbed with sharp objects. And Christopher said Setback was the unlucky one…

RO
Ronway
2013-12-18 17:43 UTC
#207

I have completed my DW versus GloomWeaver game, I am not quite sure how many rounds it was, but the environment deck had become empty the round before it ended, and this was with DW Fixer putting 1 card on the bottom of the deck, so that would probably be the 16 round when victory was achieved. Setback, Fixer, and Expat were all incapped at the end of it, with NightMist surviving at 8 Hit Points. I think it was somewhere between round 6-8 when the other heroes became incapped. Which was shortly after GloomWeaver's flip.

Around round 10 or 11, NightMist had revealed a Mist Form with Attunement, which practically sealed the fate GloomWeaver's self harming. NightMist waited for GloomWeaver to slowly murder himself, with Mr. Fixer putting tons of Zombies back on the bottom of the deck so once he got to the bottom, he would only constantly play zombies! With two Phosphorescent Chamers in play, GloomWeaver killed himself so quickly. Once he dropped into the teens however, NightMist popped out of Mist Form to send him to Oblivion.

Amulet played a huge part in keeping NightMist alive (while at the same time doubling GlooMWeaver's start of turn damage to himself), also a Mist-Fueled Recovery healing her for 12 HP.

 

Fun note! Didn't used Expat's base power once!

RA
Rabit
2013-12-18 17:48 UTC
#208

Maybe that's what they're doing… :wink:

JA
jagarciao
2013-12-18 17:55 UTC
#209

Is that what the kids call it these days?

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-18 17:57 UTC
#210

There is a custom guy on BGG called the Red Mask.  I'm pretty sure it's not him though. 

Looking at the logo on his uniform, I'm going with an assassin from the Crimson Order of Pac-Men.

They are sworn to kill ghosts by symbolically re-enacting their deaths. 

PH
phantaskippy
2013-12-18 18:06 UTC
#211

I hoped you would catch the reference.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-18 18:50 UTC
#212

Also, who is the guy Argent Adept is fighting on ExPat's? He looks like some anti-Argent Adept. I haven't seen him before, that's for sure.

DE
dedlius
2013-12-18 18:53 UTC
#213

Wild Speculation:

The guy on Mr. Fixer's Incap Side is the head of RevoCorp.

Reasoning:

1. The only reason for a villain to wear a mask is to hide his identity and protect his stature in society.

2. Other wild speculation suggests that the Dark Watch is connected to RevoCorp in some way.

3. The head of a major corporation would have plenty of reason to hide his identity if he was also a Supervillain.

BR
Braithwhite
2013-12-18 18:58 UTC
#214

The Argent Adept: Virtuoso of the Void is most certainly fighting The Tarnished Troubador: Baladeer of the Bad.

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-19 00:15 UTC
#215

Is it legitimate to use Amulet to make the opponent self-damage while you're in Mist Form?  I always assumed you couldn't…because Mist Form would keep you from taking any damage, you had nothing to redirect.

MC
McBehrer
2013-12-19 00:18 UTC
#216

correct

RO
Ronway
2013-12-19 00:20 UTC
#217

No you cannot redirect damage while in MistForm, which is something I didn't do.

EN
Envisioner
2013-12-19 00:23 UTC
#218

Okay, I guess I didn't read your message carefully enough, it sounded like that had happened.

BE
Benhimself
2013-12-20 08:08 UTC
#219

Daaaaaaaaang. Adam knocked those flipped sides OUT OF THE PARK. I want a digital version of DW Nightmist's incap side for my desktop background, now.

ZA
Zalrus9
2014-01-01 23:55 UTC
#220

Hey, has anybody played a game with DW Mr. Fixer and the origional Unity? I feel like that would a fun little metagame where equipment gets destroyed left and right, although I feel like that's also the way to lose freinds...

PY
Pydro
2014-01-02 00:09 UTC
#221

Just play with Bunker and keep him in Upgrade Mode for as long as possible.

EN
Envisioner
2014-01-02 03:17 UTC
#222

Better - have the Argent Adept in the game along with original Expatriette and Bunker.  In the ideal circumstance, Unity can play two cards with Swift Bot, Bunker two with Upgrade Mode, Expat can use Speed Loading and Load to get three out in one turn, and Argent can make players play at least three cards during his turn (perform Alacritous Subdominant and accompany Inventive Preparation), more if he has a chain running or a Silver Shadow in hand.

DR
Drakossozh
2014-01-02 06:00 UTC
#223

And then Dawn runs by and Auroras everything to oblivion.

That would suck.

EN
Envisioner
2014-01-02 08:28 UTC
#224

Right, so play against Plague Rat and you'll be fine.

NI
Nielzabub
2014-01-02 11:12 UTC
#225

If Dawn plays Aurora, DW Fixer has no qualms about using Overdrive, provided he's first in the turn cycle.

PH
phantaskippy
2014-01-06 20:23 UTC
#226

Voss.  Always go against Voss for fun shenanigans, still a challenge, doesn't mess with your stuff, lots of stuff to shoot and takes long enough to kill to get your stuff set up.

HI
Hilgendwarf
2014-01-06 21:42 UTC
#227

Just got my Dark Watch promos! Spoilers below:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 Man, Setback's flipped side is him holding a seemingly dead Expat and crying! Such great artwork and theme through these new cards! I can't wait to get them to the table!

 

PH
Phantom5613
2014-01-09 08:48 UTC
#228

I’m really eager to see how the whole team will work together. Do we know exactly when Vengeance is finally gonna ship?

PY
Pydro
2014-01-09 14:17 UTC
#229

With so many delays, GtG is trying a new shipping method. This time, they are shipping it with La Capitan. So that means it should get to you by yesterday, maybe last week, so keep an eye out.

SI
Silverleaf
2014-01-09 15:21 UTC
#230

But some cards will be under La Capitan, so you'll have to beat her up if you want a complete set. 

PH
phantaskippy
2014-01-09 22:39 UTC
#231

And she gets to keep any packages that are destroyed.

NI
Nielzabub
2014-01-09 23:49 UTC
#232

She'll also intentionally damage your packages as an excuse to keep them for herself.

IR
Ironic
2014-01-10 16:38 UTC
#233

...thus explaining how the delays happened in the first place!

DP
dpt
2014-01-10 22:05 UTC
#234

In seriousness, they have specified February but not given further details.

BR
broccoli
2014-01-10 22:13 UTC
#235

My vote is mid-february, because that's when my birthday is  :slightly_smiling_face:

PH
phantaskippy
2014-01-11 00:58 UTC
#236

I'm just hoping they announce a release party in time for me to secure transportation.

EV
EvanDan55
2014-01-11 01:14 UTC
#237

See you there, hopefully.