Absolutely Maximum Damage Possible (Though Virtually Impossible?)

While reading over my SotM cards and heroes I was trying to determine who could possibly deal the maximum amount of damage to a single target in the entire game and specifically how much. Obviously, it'd be Haka. I also tried to figure out the exact set of circumstances enable him do so. It would involve Savage Mana, also obviously, and here's what else:

Heroes:

Haka - with Savage Mana out (And nothing else)

Legacy - with Galvanize and Inspiring Presence out

Unity - with every single bot captured by Savage Mana

Visionary - with all Decoy Projections captured

Argent Adept - who is incapped and is increasing all Melee damage by one with incap ability.

Villian:

The Matriarch - every single target captured by Savage Mana (20)

Location:

The Final Wasteland - every single target (Excluding Sand Worm) captured by Savage Mana (11)

The Matriarch has 20 targets in her deck that Haka can feesibly kill, the Final Wasteland has 11 (Not including the Sand Worm since that can't really be killed since it just goes away end turn), Haka can kill Visionary's 3 decoy projections and Unity's 14 bots for another 17. 48 targets under Savage Mana. Now if he were to somehow get every single card in his deck into his hand (Other than Savage Mana) and used Haka of Battle and discarded every single card = +38 damage used in combo with Savage Mana for 48(2) + 38 + 3 = 137 total damage (I think). Just something I thought I'd post. Perhaps a little thought provoking exercise. Did I do that math correctly? Keep in mind, I was a bit bored, but excited at the same time and just thought I'd try this little experiment out. Feel free to let me know what you think.

:3

True that would be a lot of damage, but I know one better that only requires three cards. Absolute Zero with Isothermic Transducer, Ra with Imbue Fire (Visionary with Twist works aswell), and Fixed Point from Time Cataclysm. As Absolute Zero is able to go into the negatives at this point he can hit himself infinitly with fire damage and not die. Thus he can deal infinite damage to anybody he desires.

Oh yeah! XD That combo is so absolutely broken, it's hilarious. Hadn't thought of that one. I was just trying to figure out the most damage a single hero could do legitimately. These little thought excercises are fun. :3

So would that mean that by the time that AZ actually unleashes that attack that he'd effectively be a walking skeleton, having dealt himself damage into oblivion, but is still kept alive due to that fixed point? XD

One other thing about your Haka post, instead of having Argent Incapped to increase melee by one, he could instead give him a plus 3. All you'll need is Polyorphic Flare, the Harp,  Bell, Alactritous (did I butcher that spelling?) Subdominant, Syncopated Onslaught and Inspiring Supertonic.

First play the Flare to use a power, go ahead and use Volcalize to activate the Perform on the Onslaught to get a +1 buff.

Next use the Harp to allow the perform of Supertonic again, to allow Legacy to use a power. Then the accompany of the Subdominant to use a power and destroy it. Use the Bell to activate the perform of Onslaught to give Haka a +1 again.

Also Visionary has 2 copies of Twist the Ether she can toss on Haka for an additional +1 each.

The Deathworm leaves at the start of the turn, so Haka could munch on that aswell.

Yeah that's exactly how he would be. But guess what? he can hit himself infinitely more than just once with the Imbued Fire. Team him up with 4 people that have one-shots that deal damage and even use additional powers and he can unleash it a lot… Heck just on his turn playing HoarFire can do it 3 times, than Thermal Shockwave for another 2.

Where is that infinite damage coming from, though? I assume it's that he's using Thermodynamics on himself, then using the Transducer to do the damage to himself, then to himself, then to himself, then to himself, then to himself, etc., etc., etc. until he hits whatever amount of damage it is he feels like hitting to get the job done, then getting some other card effect (Inspiring Supertonic comes to mind) to let him use Thermal Shockwave? (He could also wait and use TS on his next turn but that risks Fixed Point getting nuked while he's still in the negatives.)

Considering all the damage he has done than him being in the negatives when Fixed Point leaves play would result in the enemy being in the negactives as well, thus the game has been won!

Infinite damage wouldn't just come from his base power, as Imbued Fire makes all heroes deal fire, so anyone could hit him for fire to have himself hit himself again, and again. The only villians it would be a good idea to do it against is The Dreamer, Ambuscade while in cloaking device, Chairman Pre-flip, Miss Information Pre-flip, and Baron Blade pre-flip. Well kind of on Baron Blade, as if he already has 15 cards in the trash and is in the 20 health, it would be a good idea to dispatch of him.

Punish the Weak adds another +1 if the villan target is the only non-hero target out there.

Punish the Weak works equally well as a Haka of Battle discard though. I can also wring a +4 out of AA: Use two Silver Shadows with two Alacritous Subdominants and a Polyphoric Flare to play four powers on your turn, all of which could let you use the performs of either Inspiring Supertonic or Syncopated Onslaught. Also, Unity can use Hasty Augmentation to use Savage Mana's power, for a total of 142 damage :D

What about villain damage? End of days versus Akash'Bhuta when she has all her limbs out (however many that is), the By Any Means bounty (target receives +1 damage from everything), three Obsidian Fields, both copies of Twist the Ether…any other ways to buff villain damage? I suppose someone like the Adept could have use Syncopated Onslaught on her a few times or something, if he knew End of Days had been/was about about to be played. Plus you need to make sure the Mountainous Carapaces are destroyed first, to remove her soak ASAP so she does herself max damage from everything else being destroyed. A few weeks ago we did this but the only damage buff on Akash'Bhuta was By Any Means, and she didn't have all her limbs out. And that led to a total of 103 damage :D.

I'm curious as to how Argent can reach a plus 4? I've written my +3 but i'm not thinking of the way to get another point could be added.

Even though Adept has a better use as already pointed out, I wanted to mention that Savage Mana is Haka's only source of non-melee damage, dealing toxic instead.

a change from final wasteland to realmnof discord, depending on the heroes uses (wraith) might lead to more targets with imbued vitality

Lynkfox, you're a genius.

This is all sounding very interesting now. :3

I see your three cards and raise you… two cards. Fixed Point, and Fanatic's Wrathful Retribution. She can hit herself down to negative whatever you want, and deal it all out +30 in one go.

For bonus points, she can then heal herself using Final Dive on some poor target with negative HP, causing herself negative projectile damage… if that works =)

No she can't heal herself with negative damage. Though she could play Aegis to go back up to 10 HP.

The thought of dealing negative damage that would mathmatically result in healing is hillarious

That's not actually an infinite combo; you need to deal infinite damage to Fanatic in order to deal infinite damage with her.

Also, a thought just occured to me: Hakas of Battle stack. There's not an actual upper limit on the amount of damage Haka can deal in a single blow, only practical ones.

Sure it is, she can deal at least 2 damage to herself every turn for as long as you keep the game going.

Fixed Point stays around for just one round, and she doesn't have a way to deal herself damage to deal out damage and rinse and repeat as long as she wants. She could be knocked down to below 0 and do massive damage with Wrathful Retribution, but it won't be on the scale of Absolute Zero's doing. As his is truely infinite.

And yes Haka's battle do stack, though if you discard 37 cards and save one Haka of Battle, then used that on the next turn it discarding 3 cards (1 from the draw phase of the previous turn and 2 from haka of battle) it would yield to 3 additional points of damage, considering the size of attack as it already is, i'm not so sure 3 more damage would really do much, as Akash'Bhuta would be the only one that could of survive it.

Here's my idea for max damage (discounting the fun infinities from Fixed Point):

1. Haka of Battle, discarding Haka's deck.
2. Rampage, hitting Akash'Bhuta with the first big hit and all of her Limbs (which have been kindly reduced to low hp for you) with the smaller hits.
3. The Limbs are destroyed, causing A'B to hit herself for a bunch of damage, and stored under Savage Mana.
4. Power for Savage Mana, dealing a nice big chunk of damage itself and destroying the Limbs again!

Haka's discard has to be from hand. Other than that, very shiny!

I think he may have been refering to the fact that he has the entire deck in his hand. Other than the other cards needed to do this.

He could also be refering to Haka of Battle stating it is Haka's next attack. Nothing is stopping you from discarding your entire deck, shuffle for re-draw and later discarding your whole deck. Eventually you run out of health and go incapacitated, but you can string a couple of them together for one massive damage boost.

I was referring to having the remainder of Haka's deck in hand, but I suppose that both interpretations are correct.

Wasn't there also the Distortion card from realm of distortion that turns all non-target cards into targets. So you can use rampage to also eat all your allies' card for more power to Salvage Mana.

Imbued Vitality. I think that was already mentioned earlier in the thread :).

So to recap, we now have two methods so far of dealing theoretically infinite damage -

1. Absolute Zero with Isothermic Transducer, Imbued Fire or Twist the Ether, and Fixed Point.

2. Haka, with Hakas of Battle and a whole lot of time.

Any more?

If you've got a loooot of time, then at least one incapacitated hero can give a +2 to any hero's next damage dealt each turn. Or, Chrono-Ranger and Expatriette can stack an infinite number of 1-damage projectile attacks on a power, which is somewhat stymied by damage resistance but can be used to murder every goddamn thing you want dead.

I think Chrono-Ranger's incap is an immediate effect, so it won't actually stack.

Whoops, you're right. Expatriette's still works though!

Though realistically only Abzeros is true Infinite damage. infinite damage combos have to be done all at once, in one round to really /count/

*snicker*

the absolute max damage you could do (besides AZ) is 154 damage to all non-hero targets with Omnitron-X, using only one power.

How? Do tell :D

It involves Fixed Point, Tendrils of madness (wrested to hit Omnitron), Plague Rat's advanced rules, Plague Locus, Legacy (with Inspiring presence), Argent Adept (Syncopated Onslaught x2, and an extra galvanize), Visionary (both twist the ether), Unity (2 hasty augmentations; one on Argent, doubling his contribution, and one on Omnitron, and a swift bot), all 3 platings, and defensive blast.

Basically, use fixed point to have all 3 platings out, and have the tendrils hit Omnitronks. Then Legacy galvanizes and inspires, Argent uses Syncopated onslaught twice and Supertonic once for a bonus galvanize. THEN Unity plays hasty augmentation on Argent (for 2 more onslaughts and a galvanizing supertonic) and one more on Omnitron for a +2 boosted Defensive blast, with all 3 platings. This causes him to do one point of damage of each damage type -- boosted by 13 each -- for a total of 14 points of each type to all non-hero targets.

Granted, there's a LOT of setup involved, but it's the absolute max that I could come up with.

Bonus points for going against Akash'Bhuta. You lose the +2 from Plague Rat, but giving Argent's +4 from the onslaughts to AB makes her suicide that much faster.

That's… beautiful. I think I can build on it though 

So we have 1 + 1 (TC) + 2 (PR) + 2 (Leg) + 3 (AA) + 2 (Vis) + 5 (Uni) = 16. (Huh. You did better than you thought :P) But a Polyphoric Flare or even a Silver Shadow can get you +4 on AA's go, so you get 17 per attack, or 187 total

Please explain how you are using Polyphoric Flare to get an additional point on AA's turn, as this is the second time you have mentioned it, and all Instruments and Vocalize are already covered on Argent's power phase.

Yeah, there's still the limit of one power per turn, and the Bell and Vocalize are the only ones that let you use a Rhythm, and Legacy can only Galvanize once.

Still, I did miscount the one against Plague Rat. My bad.

Whoops, my bad! I was Galvanising twice 

Polyphoric Flare will get you an extra point all right, but the problem is you need it or Alacritious Subdominant to get the damage boost from Syncopated Onslaught up to two.

I was already factoring that in. I was using the harp with supertonic and subdominant for an extra galvanize and an extra vocalize.

Actually, I came up with a little extension. All of that happens, but on Omnitron's turn he uses Time Slip to have Argent Adept play a polyphoric flare, giving him an additional +3. Thus, 206.

The problem is, the +3 combo only works twice; each requires the destruction of an Alacritous Subdominant, of which you only have two. It might be possible, if you're at the end of your deck and then reshuffle so that the Subdominant is on top, but it'd be tricky to work out, even hypothetically. Erm... I guess you could use a Flare on your turn to get the +3, then use your power phase to activate Omnitronks' power and play Vernal Sonata, and put the Subdominant on top of your deck, so you'd then draw it. Then Omnitronks on his turn Timeshifts AA, throwing out a Silver Shadow. He can use tha to give another +3, then use Silver Shadow to play the Subdominant in his hand? Does that work?

Fixed Point.

Oh, of course, I forgot about that card that's vital to make this entire combination actually. work. Silly me again.

Also, Alacritous Subdominant is not destroyed until after fulfilling the extra power use. Thus, if the extra power activates another use of Alacritous Subdominant, it is not yet destroyed and can be used again. Only once you’ve finished using that power do you destroy it, thus limiting it’s use to effectively once per initial power use rather than once per activation. Of course, Fixed Point makes this point moot.
(Every time I think of Fixed Point, I think of the Dead Sea in Chrono Cross (which is how far I’ve made it in the game before taking a hiatus.)