Future of Sentinels of the Multiverse

I’m new to the game and absolutely love it!

I played it at GenCon and of course purchased a copy after a fantastic demo. Kudo’s to the crew running the booth.

One of the things that was discussed was the potential for future releases for the game. One recommendation I have for future products takes a after a move by Fantasy Flight Games…Print on Demand card expansions. They’ve (FFG) done this with their 40K card game and I think it would offer an opportunity to push out future products if the economics of producing large print runs ever becomes an issue. I offer this suggestion because I think this game has the potential to be one of those classic games that has a long run of fantastic expansions…and I want to see it succeed.

Bring on more SotM!!! ;D ;D ;D

I don’t know about the creators themselves, but I’m not familiar with the Print on Demand model. Care to elaborate?

Totally didn’t know the answer to this either but looked it up the other day after reading this. What I have gathered from my one minute of research is people will order, or “demand”, an expansion online then the company would print and ship it to the recipient. But that sounds more like the best thing to do for a booster pack type deal, something they aren’t really considering right now. But I am going on a limb to assume that they might be doing that for people who order a deck online to replace anything they have damaged beyond use.

We are actually considering doing a kickstarter (http://www.kickstarter.com) to raise money for our first expansion some time this fall. That way, people can pledge money to help us cover printing costs, and will then get the expansion (or various other super awesome prizes which are currently secret) in return.

The concept behind “Print on Demand” or POD is that the vendor doesn’t produce a large stock pile of the item, cards in this case (but it could be books, etc.). They design the product, advertise it, and when a customer wants it they produce it (or use another service provider to print the product. ala LULU) specifically to fulfill the specific order. I’ve purchased several books and the aforementioned cards from FFG via POD. In the case of the 40K card game the expansion was more than just a booster (granted they weren’t a large number of cards); it offered a new squad of marines and a new brood of genestealers to expand/change the basic set up for the game.

At GenCon it was mentioned that potential SotM expansions might already be in the works or on the drafting board, and any future products would depend on how sales for the game turn out. I offered the suggestion of POD as a more affordable means for expanding the games range, which of course could vary in size from booster sized expansions or larger…governed by the economics of the situation.

;D I just looking to see a good game grow!

Awesome! Thanks for the reply and heads up! ;D ;D ;D

Any idea of how much you need raise?

We are discussing that with the printer now and looking at our options. The kickstarter would probably be in the $20K range, but that is subject to change based on info from the printer, etc

If the expansion and other super awesome prizes will be given away then I will definately give some money to the kickstarter. Because I would like to see this game thrive, and doing my best to spread the word.

I’m glad to hear it!

And the only things we know for sure about the Kickstarter are that 1) anyone who pledges at least the price of the expansion will get a copy of it and 2) there will be many truly fabulous prizes for sponsors

Is there a possiblity of 3)People who pledge so much can also submit a Hero idea and a few hero card ideas for that Hero? I for one have ideas that roam through my head, I just never take the time to actually do anything about it.

Generally speaking, we are prevented from accepting ideas for characters/cards/etc by our lawyers, who are full of legal concerns about all sorts of things when it comes to intellectual property :). However! It is quite likely that anyone willing to contribute a sufficient sum toward the expansion will be able to get their likeness in the art on a card!

That is just as good!

If it was contributed as part of a contest, where all participants formally waive rights to their submitted ideas, they might be more accommodating. And if the winner for “best idea” (or something) gets their idea created and their image on the card, you’d probably get a lot of interesting submissions.

Rabit

So you can’t really accept any ideas as far as characters, character designs, cards, etc, but what about a gameplay mechanic? I just had the idea in my head for a “hero character” that is not a target (has no HP). While at first it would seem to remove challenge to have a character that can’t be incompacitated, some villains have alternate win conditions such that the heroes need not be incompacitated, and the rules could simply be updated such that no hero targets in play constitute a villain win. Types of not-target characters could be one that simply enhances other players such as a character that represents a country cheering on the rest of the heroes (think something like a playable benificial envionment deck or such), or it could even be a deck full of “hero minions,” such as a character representing a village being attacked, with various villiager cards which then become multiple “heroes” for the player.

The same legal principle goes for mechanics as well, and it’s far less likely we’d have any sort of mechanic contest than we would a character contest. The character contest seems like a possibility legally with waiver of copyright, though I don’t see us having one any time soon as we have the next four expansions pretty much planned out. We have a lot of really exciting things in store!

My wife and I discussed this over the weekend, here is what I would like to see.

Semi regular “packs” with any three of the four - 1-2 Heroes, 1 villain, 1 environment. So, 1 of each, or 2 Heroes, and a villain.

Super team packs - 4 - 5 Heroes.

Rogues Gallery packs - 3 Villains.

I’d easily pay 10 - 20 bucks for an expansion like this, which would be about a MTG starter deck sized box. Depending on the number of things included.

Also, you need to release some kind of storage solution for it! I’d shell out bucks for an official storage solution for the base game, with room for expansions. I currently have everything hair-banded up in the base game box, which works, but I’d love someting pretty.

Our “standard” expansions will be 4 villains, 2 heroes and 2 environments for something in the $15-$20 range. Printing bigger print runs like this lets us keep the cost-per-deck down, and our gameplay experience and much of the feedback we’ve gotten indicates that what the game really needs (at least at first) is more villains to challenge the heroes. In the base game, there are really 2 “intro” villains (Blade and Omnitron) and 2 “regular” villains (Voss and Dawn) in terms of difficulty. We want to make sure that we add additional interesting challenges for players. In terms of heroes, the 10 heroes in the base set give players a ton of options in terms of game play styles, and most people find a few heroes they really enjoy and stick to those. We want to make sure that any future heroes we add have unique and interesting play styles, so we don’t want to release too many.

Anyhow, that’s our reasoning for the layout of the “standard expansions”. That having been said, we have various other types of expansions planned. We’d also very much like to release a better storage solution for the base game for those who are interested.

So does that mean Voss and Dawn are like “normal mode” and we might be seeing some “hard mode” villains in the near future?? Also I totally agree with you, I want more villains way more than heroes right now.

Well, all Villains have a “hard mode” currently: Advanced Mode. Personally, I’d like to see a lot more discussion on this forum about “Advanced Mode” play, as it’s really where the challenge in the game lies. Also, it’s where many unexpected things can happen.

That’s very true. Baron Blade often seems like a cakewalk on regular, but can really surprise you on advanced.

Here is a question. Is there a possibility of one of the Thorathians or Citizens may actually become a Villian Character Card? It could represent the defeat of their leader and some of the allies so that way there is more room in the deck for the new cards.

That would require an entire re-release of that Villain deck, which, while it is possible that we could do something like that at some point, we have so many ideas for future sets that it would be a long time before we did anything like that. There are tons of things to look forward to that are completely different from everything you’ve seen in the game so far, rather than rehashing what you already know.

What I’d really love to see is a hero duo team, but done as one card. Say like have a fire hero and ice hero on the same card, but still have them be at the same amount of power as a regular hero.

I’m actually much more interested, now, in seeing characters that are setup as a team from the get go. That two players need to work together to make them the most effective. I imagine this happening in a similar way to how the Citizens of the Sun teams work except based on limited cards that each character has or have it so the two characters share equipment (each has copies of a limited equipment card that helps them both). It would be really hard to do well, I think, but I bet the Sentinels team could do it.

I like both of those ideas. I also think it would be cool if a certain group of heroes combined and transformed to a ultra mega super hero for a turn or something. Like Voltron.

With as many things as we have planned, there is unfortunately no Voltron deck. Nor will there be Thundercats, Masters of the Universe, or Ninja Turtles, though my passion for the last one causes it to be agonizing.

Well, couldn’t you make Pubescent Deviated Samurai Lizards?

I suppose we COULD, but they wouldn’t mesh so well with the world we’ve created.

I think I remember at Gen Con hearing Chris say one of the expansions is “time and space”. I immediately thought that to mean we’d be seeing some heroes from the past or future, like a cowboy or a space explorer.

Because I like information torture almost as much as he does, I’ll say that in that set yes, we have a hero from the past and one from the future, but they’re neither of the two you mentioned.

Hmm… That “Red Legacy” is from a future, but also part of Visionary’s past… so… heheheh.

Better yet, I wanna see these Time and Space villains. I’m sure they’re going to be a blast. Though I’m assuming any villain from a long time ago would require an army at his/her side to make up for the lack of technology.

Unless they have superpowers.

I’m stoked about those villains, too, but I’m not giving you anything there yet. Sorry. :-X

Wait, who’s “Red Legacy”?

Take a look at Visionary’s “Prophetic Vision.”

Official note: there will be no character named “Red Legacy”.

What about Bread Legacy?

That’s fine, we’ve already got two Legacys. That’s enough big time American heroes for me.

You officially state there will not be a character named “Red Legacy” while not stating in any way if who I’m refering to “Red Legacy” will exist as a character. What torture, heheheh.

Good catch there, Jay. What could this mean?!

It COULD mean that Christopher is a sneaky snarky person who likes to keep people in suspense.
Just sayin’.

It means “Red Legacy” is angrier than “White Legacy.” Now we just need to find a “Blue Legacy.”

has anyone noticed a guy dressed in a red legacy costume fighting legacy in legacy’s “Thokk!” card? looks different than in visionary’s prophetic card

I just looked at that. That’s not the same “Red Legacy” we’ve been thinking of… and he’s got the same symbol… Ugh, so much confusion!

Though, maybe we’re looking too much into things.

I’d say you’re looking a good amount into things.

But certainly not too much. Nor too little. But looking is definitely happening. This much I’ll vouch for.

Well, we have to do something to keep entertained.

This is getting kind of interesting. Makes me want to go through all the cards to see what else I can notice. But I probably won’t do that, i’ll just start examining them more when I am playing the game.

You could always play Sentinels of the Multiverse!

I did, was playing with one of my brothers and teaching my other brother (so… uhm… all three of use were playing, yeah), and managed to get shut out by Baron Blade… Very embarassing.
Villain trash had 14 cards when the last villian card played managed to incapacitate all three of us at once.

Though, playing as Wraith, Absolute Zero, and Bunker are probably not the best combination.

Playing against Omnitron with Legacy, Tempest, and Fanatic had much better results (actually came very close to shutting out Omnitron).

I keep thinking I’ll look at them while I’m playing, but I never have time – too busy figuring out what is going on and what to do.

What does ‘shutting out’ mean in this context?

A shutout is a term in competitive sports to refer to a perfect win. In this game, it would refer to defeating the opponent while maintaining current HP at maximum HP.

Aha. A shutout in baseball is not precisely the same as a perfect game. I thought you might have just meant that all the heroes survived, not that they were all at max HP.

Yeah, a shutout in baseball just means the other team didn’t score (which is more or less what happened with Baron Blade, we never did any damage at all to him). A perfect game in baseball is different, it means every pitch is a strike (or something like that), and we didt take some villain targets out, so it wouldn’t compare to a perfect game I’d guess. So, the other team didn’t score, that’s how I’d describe the Baron Blade game, and almost how I’d describe the Omnitron game.

Oh I know what’s going to happen…

It will be alternate multiverse where our heroes will be villains and have mustaches including Tachyon, Visionary and Wraith!

And goatees and gold lamé belts.

I’d buy two copies!!!

Well, hey, it IS called Sentinels of the MULTIVERSE. So maybe that other Legacy is just and Alt. universe Legacy. An “Alt Legacy”. Just like on Tachyon’s Fleet of Foot, there’s a red clad Tachyon. So we’ve got an Alt Legacy AND an Alt Tachyon? This is getting insane…

From what I understand about Tachyon’s Fleet of Foot card from another post is that it is a villian but isn’t near as good as Tachyon. I forgot which topic it was on though.

You’re probably thinking of the “Favorite Flavor Text,” quoting Fleet of Foot - “Dude, you are not my nemesis!”

It was actually discussed in one of the topics, I asked about it and it was responded that Tachyon was saying that because she didn’t see the other as good enough to be a nemesis.

Ah! Found it. It was in nemeses speculation.

Oh yes, that is where it was. That topic died surprisingly fast. It happens I guess. Still excited to see how many of my guesses are correct or at least close to what they are.

Either way, I’m assuming that if there’s a different version of Legacy, I’m assuming there’s going to be other versions of the other heroes. Not to be redundant, but if there’s an alt universe with a different Legacy, there’s got to be alt heroes.

Unless they’re… dead. O_O

I just assumed that those were just run-of-the-mill evil alternate universe versions, which is a pretty common trope in comics. When you have a hero who’s so powerful that nobody else can beat them, who better to pit them against than themselves? My guess is that they were just minor characters in each hero’s story, a short little one-shot episode.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and since I haven’t seen it mentioned yet, “Dude, you are not my nemesis” is a direct quote from Dr. Horrible’s Sing-Along Blog, so I think it’s likely that it’s just throwaway fluff.

Who says that would stop any of them. O_o

Dead, alive, or other, I’m certain the Multiverse part of this game is gonna come into play heavily soon enough.

I figured it was just a play on the term “Guardians of the Universe” along with the fact that most comic series involve a multiverse. In any case, the whole “Multiverse” part of the game is already in effect, as The Visionary is from an alternate future (if I’m not mistaken, from two alternate futures).

I can’t say for sure about how much Multiverse-ness will come into play. However, TheJayMann is right (maybe?).

It kind of depends on how you want to look at time travel.
If things were to proceed without The Visionary coming back in time, they would happen as they have already done so in her past. However, now she has come back in time to stop those events from happening.

One school of time travel, which doesn’t make so much sense, would have her altering her own universe. The problem with this is that then there’s no reason for her to travel back through time to alter it. This time travel idea is a little brighter because it posits that one could fix the past, but like I said, it doesn’t make much sense this way.

The second school of time travel suggests that every time someone alters the past a new universe branches off. I don’t know if anyone here reads it, but Dr. McNinja has been dealing with this concept lately.

Ah, the old grandfather paradox. So long as there is no one that goes back in time, kills his grandfather, then hooks up with his grandmother, effectively becoming his own grandfather. Though that would make him immune to giant brains trying to take over the earth.

What a sad day it would be if I became my own grandfather, luckily neither of my grandmothers were attractive, go me!

I personally like the idea of the new universe branching off to form an alternate universe instead. Since the other one is a nonstop cycle as to what would really happen.

If anyone’s interested in further reading on this, there’s the Grandfather paradox that TheJayMann mentioned and the answer to it in the form of the many-worlds interpretation. For the case of SotM, I think I’m gonna go with the latter.

The many-worlds theory is my personal favorite, though I tend to like collecting universes.