Extremist Sky-Scraper Unlock Discussion

I know the stream is still going, and honestly I don’t even know for sure if SS is the next unlock, but I’m hoping that by making the thread I can cause it to be so.

Your willpower is as yet unable to twist reality.  Sorry.

#nomanssky

Good luck once it’s actually released which is not this day.  

I had figured it'd be Sky today, Argent for Halloween, and Cosmic after that... now I feel disappoint.

So much for making sure everyone has one.

And ESS is one of my favorites, too!

Oh well…

The anti-Thorathian bigotry being exhibited by Sky-Scraper being the only hero without a variant in the video-game is getting sickening. You can't believe everything that Maerynian malcontent says.

#VossWasRight

I haven't played her Variant enough. I was more excited for Requital TBH. 

I actually played variant SS for the first time a few weeks ago. It's a blast. I'm still happier to have Requital, but definiately looking forward to Sky's week, especially because I'm not a huge fan of the Dark Conductor variant. 

I wonder why they're choosing the order they are.  Is it the order the variants would have first appeared in the comic books?  I thought BoT Chrono would have been before the Xtreme Prime Wardens, though, and it seems like Requital Captain Cosmic is very late (when OblivAeon is actively attacking in person).

Maybe ask that on the next stream?

Honestly, I just assumed it was "we're done bug testing this one as much as we can, it's time to release it". I could see Extremist Sky Scraper being last in this group because of all the different powers and effects. The incapacitated powers alone...

Though I guess the game isn't being updated in the midst of these groups of releases, so that theory probably doesn't hold water.

Yeah, they said on the stream that they're basically working 100% on One Deck Dungeon right now.  Although have they ever previewed Extremist?  I don't watch all the streams, but I've never seen her in action.

They have shown extremist , at least twice ( that is on two different streams) Once against the dreamer and I forgot the other one. She looked ready to me, no fpo or any crash caused by her

They said they're working 97% on One Deck Dungeon and 3% on Sentinels.

And I gotta admit Sky's the one I've been most wanting out of this set. I didn't really have a big yen for another Vis, Cosmic and Chrono's powers are interesting but not must-haves, and while the artwork & SFX for Dark Conductor is creepily awesome I'm not sure about the power itself.

But I totally would like a variant that makes it easier to change up Sky's sizes, since currently I have a bad tendency to play her Tiny all the time and only switch in the rare occasion I run out of Links. Also Sky is awesome in general.

Interesting.  I generally play her Huge and only go Tiny if I don't have a way of growing, or if I want to play a quick burst of links with Linking Incursion.

Missed that bit about ODD. I often can't run audio on the streams and have to rely on chat for info. 

You poor thing, we're nothing but tangents and speculation D:

Yeah, generally the chat only vaguely resembles anything actually going in the stream. (With the possible exception of Tales From the Archive but that's mainly because ALD often borrows our insane tangents.)

Like, the ongoing chat topics are generally some combo of:

Bad puns.
Snark.
Wild speculation.
Commenting on characters' hair and/or outfits.
Gushing about the recent Letters Page.
Commenting on Jeremy's shirt and/or hair.
#blamejohn
Making fun of Lewd.
Sonvar gushing about Guise.
Weird headcanons.

To be fair, Sonvar/Powerhound does that everywhere.

Guise is the best.  I’m not surprised at all a conversation that started about Extremist Sky-Scraper became about Guise 

You're right, a discussion about Sky-Scraper should probably more contain gushing about Baron Blade or KNYFE. ;)

I can confirm that the first step in Extremist Sky-Scrapper unlock is that MigrantP releases her from under the microscope slide he currently has her trapped under.

Tomorrow, SURELY

Tomorrow, MigrantP releases the Freedom-Five achievements and we start unlocking them. 

Get ready for Setting Sun Ra!

If it IS tomorrow, should we start on a new thread just so we can start of fresh and not have to sift through all the previous thread to get to the actual unlocking stuff?

Since DST just happened, Setting Sun Ra would be pretty on point. It's a really fun variant for Ra! 

Wait, Sky-who? 

I KNEW IT! Here we go!

I was really confused for a moment because I saw no one talking about the variant. Then I found is not from today. Welp... Now we gotta go to work.

Well, I tried my Advanced Plague Rat damage-fest to see if we had a Hunted Naturalist situation on our hands. Doesn't look like we do. I finished PR off once in Huge, once with Explosive Reveal, and once with Catch a Ride. Nothing doing. Time to try taking her to sillytown... 

Got it! Pretty sure I’m first! Already shared it.

I played against Baron Blade, at Zhu Long’s Temple. Made sure to change size a whole bunch, multiple times per turn. Had Proportionist. Used every power.

Finished him off by playing Emergency Evac, and the damage from turning Normal size finished him off.

It took me EXACTLY one game, so there are no multiple-game hurdles to jump through.

I tried a similar strategy, Baron Blade at Freedom Tower. Tachyon was on the team, no unlock.

My team was SS, Argent, TLT, Grampa Legacy.

Huh. Well, my change forms with proportionist out a lot game didn't work, so clearly I didn't do it enough. Or didn't do something else. Congrats, McB - is this your first HOF spot?

Yep! Probably my last, too. I’m usually not very good at this.

I made sure to deal damage as each size, use each size’s power, and play one of each card. I’m pretty sure I used every single one-shot and Link. I also changed size in each combination; small to normal, small to huge, normal to small, normal to huge, huge to normal, and huge to small.

Also, although I did play Emergency Evac, I didn’t destroy any Links with it, so there were a few in play at the end of the game. It was the damage triggered by changing size, from Proportionist, that finished him off.

So I don’t know which of these is the key, but my guess is that you have to destroy so many targets with the Proportionist damage. Maybe including the villain? And also maybe you have to end in Normal size?

I feel happy that you got it, since you were really excited to have her variant.

I failed while playing Sky, KNYFE, SST, Omni-X, and Vis in the Block against Blade, and tried changing sizes a bunch, but I didn't get to get Proportionist out until late and never got to use her Huge power. Finished off Blade with a Compulsion Cannister while Tiny.

Edit: And yeah, I notice that too, Tskami_ek. Huh.

I was concerned about having to win with Explosive Reveal, but I managed to pull it off in my "do all the things and swap sizes a ton" game. Having Legacy and Chrono-Ranger around helped a lot. I definitely didn't play everything, though I activated Proportionist's effects at least three times each. Maybe it's more along the lines of 5 times each. Destroying targets with the damage from Proportionist just seems mean, but I guess it's possible.

To clarify, you super don’t have to win using Explosive Reveal. I didn’t.

Here's a failure log:

Unlocked, ended with Explosive Reveal.

Baron Blade, Zhu Long.

Went to HUGE, then to NORMAL on Environment turn

https://pastebin.com/CFwMJ1J6

Baron Blade, Zhu Long, ended with Huge power. I was going for "change sizes twice in one turn 5 times", but really didn't end up narrowing much down, since I did a fair bit.

Well... I was gonna say "good luck," but I toook a nap and it's already been found? Nice.

Good luck with the condition, everybody! 

I think it may in fact be something to do with changing sizes twice in one turn a certain number of times. I've had two unlock fails. In one I had one turn where I changed size twice in a turn and a "valid turns: 1", in another I never changed more than once and had "valid turns: 0". And I'm looking and so far UXM's and Tskami's logs match up with that overall idea.

So, it might contain something like with Sky-Scraper on the team versus Baron Blade, have at least three turns where she changes size twice during that turn?

Hmm... how are you having her change size twice on her own turn? With Colossal Left Hook?

I’ve tried a couple of games with no luck.

The numbers shown at the end of the logs seem to indicate Sky-Scraper’s turn each round, so it looks like doing actions outside of her turn. Possibly something like.

Win a game against Baron Blade with Sky-Scraper on the team. During X of Sky-Scraper’s turns, Sky-Scraper must do Y.

Current working theory is X is 3 or more, and Y is either change forms two or more times, or must be Tiny, Normal, and Huge within the same turn.

Those numbers most definately don't correspond to Skyscraper's turns, unless Skyscraper somehow got 4 turns in a row in my first attempt.

Got an unlock with Sky, PW Argent, Vis, and Grandpa Legacy vs Blade in Freedom Tower. Basically just tried to switch sizes twice in one turn as many times as possible via both Colossal Left Hook and Argent feeding her two out of turn plays a turn.

Here's all my logs:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qyitehs9emxwq2o/Sky-Scraper%20Unlock%20Fail%201.txt?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/72gcreymikelmwb/Sky-Scraper%20Unlock%20Fail%202.txt?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/v0h6498bg44tf8m/Sky-Scraper%20Unlock%20Success.txt?dl=0

I know what the numbers in the unlock text mean.

They are recording turn numbers, including Villain and environment turns, with the first Villain turn being turn 0.

The list of "ALL TURNS" is the turns in which Sky-Scraper switched size.

This is proven in UXM266's log, which has 3 heroes.  He first switches in Sky Scraper's first turn (turn 3) and then waits until her third turn (turn 13) to switch again.  He switches again in the following Environment turn (turn 14) and then waits until SS's next turn (turn 18) before switching.  This matches his list.

THere are three turns where he switches more than once, and his Valid Turns are 3, so that is almost certainly the meaning of that.

So we know the thing she has to do is switch twice within the same turn.  We just need to figure out what the number of valid turns needs to be, if she can be incapped and whether the heroes can lose to finish off the unlock conditions.

Edit: We do have proof that 1 valid turn is not enough and 3 is.  We just need to try two valid turns.

Edit 2: I guess we also need tests against Mad Bomber Blade.

I did the change twice in a turn a bunch theory. No unlock. Had sky kill Baron in Zhu Long. Used porpotionist damage a lot. Was changing off turn with Omni and mysterious ceremonies. Didn't kill with porpotionist.

Edit: From now on for simplicity's sake we should refer to the double switch thing as a valid. I wonder if there is a minimum number of valids AND a maximum number of valids.

Are you on a platform on which you could get a log (Steam or Android) Lemee_Adam?  Can you also confirm that you can see the variant for Sky-Scraper in the hero selection box?

I think I just confirmed that the heroes have to win.  I let time run out on Wagner's and the Valid turns text didn't show up.  This isn't 100% proof, as I was also trialling 2 valid turns, but we'll see.

Via Steam, 2 valid turns isn't enough.

I've just done some more testing...

I now believe 'valid turns' actually require all three forms in play in the same turn.  I did some tests where I switched from Normal to Huge and back to Normal and I had 0 Valid turns at the end.

Can we confirm that count via log?

I unlocked against base Baron Blade in the Temple, per McB's original. And made a point of having Sky-Scraper go between all three forms in the same turn three times (no more, no less).

NOTE: I will say that at first I was reading as "within the same round," which I managed far more easily with the help of XPWAA, so I may have skewed my data. That said, if we assume Valid Turns are what they seem to be, here's the current construction I'm seeing:

1) Win a game [per jorgenp above]

2) Against Baron Blade [nobody has confirmed a win against another, it's thematically appropriate; no confirmation whether Mad Bomber Blade works]

3) [no Environment condition, we've seen successes in multiple places]

4) With Sky-Scraper on the team [there do not appear to be any other required individuals]

5) In at least three turns, Sky-Scraper must switch between all three sizes.

6) [Additional conditions, primarily, who if anybody must not be incapacitated? SS must not be, nobody can be...]

7) Anything else.

I know that's a complicated breakdown, but there you go. If it were me stacking the conditions, though, I'd suggest this:

WIn a game against any variant of Baron Blade with Sky-Scraper on the team. In at least three turns, Sky-Scraper must switch between all three sizes, and Sky-Scraper must not be incapacitated when you win.

Here's a summary...

We know (or highly suspect) the following:

1. Baron Blade mut be the Villain (not Mad Bomber Blade)
2. Heroes must win
3. Sky-Scraper must have all three forms within a single turn at least 3 times
4. Environment doesn't matter
5. Sky-Scraper does not need the final blow

What we need to figure out:

1. Can Sky-Scraper be incapped?
2. Must Sky-Scraper be in Normal mode at the end? (very unlikely)
3. Is there anything else special that must be done?

Edit: Heh, we thought alike...

Great minds and allathat. I can rule out SS dealing the final blow–XPWAA had that honor on mine.

Hmm. Let's not jump too far down the rabbit hole. Someone on Steam may have evidence that a Valid Turn is "two changes," not necessarily "all three forms."

OK, Mad Bomber Blade does not give the Valid turns info printout, so he is almost certainly out.

I have attached my proof for it being all three forms.  There are two turns where I switch twice (Tachyon's first turn(4)  and Sky-Scraper's first turn (5)), but the valid turn count is zero.  If the Steam person has a log to show that two switches without going through all three forms can be valid, I'd love to see it, as we can compare the difference.

Well, all I know is I just did a match against Bomber Blade in Freedom Tower where I had three turns of Colossal Left Hooking into a second form switch (making sure she went either normal -> huge -> tiny or tiny -> huge -> normal) and nothing happened. Proportionist was out the whole time. iOS, so no log. Figured I'd give it a shot even if I can't log it.

I think I just miscounted,  since I had an undo so I thought it might have been counting that,  but looking through my log I actually did the three form turns twice on SS turn and twice on XPWAA turn.   SS ended in tiny form in my game so definitely does not need to be normal size to unlock. Nobody was incapped in my game.

https://pastebin.com/g3ULfeTT

Repeated the exact same thing I'd just done against Bomber Blade vs. regular Blade, except without ever playing Proportionist, and it worked. Sky never used her Huge power, so there's definitely nothing about using every power in there. 

Maybe Tachyon isn't allowed on the team, like Legacy for the Freedom Six variants?? She wouldn't help Sky augment her powers...

That feel when you are about to incap Sky-Scraper just before you finish Blade and then the Environment plays a card that would kill Blade.  You try re-winding to realise there's no way to stop it.  And then you decide whether to restart the game to get some useful data, or just go ahead and unlock the variant and not bother helping out...

Rest assured, I took one for the team...  Here I go again on attempt 3 to test Sky-Scraper incap (first test failed due to incorrectly counting valid turns).

OK, it's perfectly acceptable for Sky-Scraper to be incapped, and I assume anyone else.

I also had Super Scientific Tachyon on my team.

I barely played anything on Sky-Scraper beyond her sze changing cards.  I think we can call this:

Win a fight against regular Baron Blade with (regular?) Sky-Scraper on the team.  There must be at least three turns where Sky-Scraper has all three of her character cards in play at some point during the turn.

What else could there be that we can test? (Edit : I have confirmed we can't test if it needs to be regular SS.  Unlocking Extremist stops the text for Valid turns being added)

Edit: I suppose it could be "Sky-Scraper is the only hero that may be incapacitated.  Does anyone want to test this?

Log is attached (watch out for undos as there are a LOT).

Edit 2: Turns out it wasn't hard to remove my undos actually...  I attached the edited one with undos undone too.

Unlocked:

I made sure to switch sizes to all 3 forms in 1 turn exactly 3 times to try to confirm the current theory.

Can anyone think of what else to test apart form if there is a "Nobody can be incapacitated except Sky-Scraper" clause?

Just got it! Team was SS, TLT, AA, Old Legacy, and Crono Ranger. Villain was Baron Blade, environment was Freedom Tower. Made sure to change sizes multiple times on several turns (at least 3). Also, just like the first person to unlock it, the final blow was dealt by the extra damage from Proportionist for changing size, not sure if that matters (I think someone dealt the final blow with Explosive Reveal, so probably not). Changed size every turn at least once.

I accessed all three forms four times, three of which I had proportionist in play. I don't know how to get the log, but I will if someone tells me how.

I didn't have Tachyon on my team, but I thought that it might be if Tachyon is on the team she cannot affect SS? The bio for Extremist SS does not mention Tachyon though, so she could be irrelavent

I have a real hard time keeping track of these unlock threads, but I wanted to ask, does Proportionist need to be in play/have been played during the game to unlock?

I never played Proportionist in my unlock.  I had TLT,  and she was had SS do tons of card draw to dig for the Colossal Left Hooks.

The community has discovered the official unlock condition for Extremist Sky-Scraper:

Win a game against Baron Blade with regular Sky-Scraper on the team. Three separate times in the game, Sky-Scraper must be Tiny, Normal, and Huge over the course of a single turn.

Good job!

Longest wait, fastest find?

*Conditions Already Found*

Well that was a quick one.  I just got caught up reading the thread and we've got her unlocked.

Time to go unlock I guess, before I even have a chance to help out.

I'm not a fan of this "valid turn" statistic at the end of the Steam log. It seemed finding the conditions became way too easy. The patterns are a lot easier to recognize when you have someone pointing the patterns out to you. Plus it also means anyone not on Steam has very little to contribute to the hunt.

Damn, that was fast. Just as I was coming in to report a failure

I finished the weekly one-shot yesterday, I started it a little bit after the twitch livestream when I was about to start the unlock, just to find it was already discovered.

At this rate, with the sheer number of awesome players I'll never be have my name in the Hall of Fame for a second time #humblebrag

Gotta say, though -- Argent Adept and Zhu Long are MVP for this unlock.

The debug log was left in by accident, we did not intend for it to be easy to discover.

So much for saving my unlock for testing.

Thanks for letting us know. There's only so many variants left to release and unlock. I want to get my puzzle-solving money's worth.

Weeks of fan build-up, not even a full day needed to find the unlock.

Sure hope no one bet on this one being as long as the last couple. ;P

I didn’t.  I have my guesses on which will take longest for the next set of six but I won’t say that here.   

I don't think it mattered a whole lot.  The unlock condition turned out to be one of the things people have been speculating it was going to be for weeks.  I'm sure it would have been solved within 24 hours anyway.

Zhu Long didn't do me a whole lot of good, but Argent Adept sure did.  Log attached, just for kicks, showing 7 "valid rounds".  For a long time it was Colossal Left Hook plus a Tiny card on Sky-Scraper's turn, then a Huge card plus Rest and Recover to get that Colossal Left Hook back on Argent Adept's turn.  Easy peasy.  Could have kept it going longer, except I put Proportionist out, and that plus the environment kept whittling Baron Blade down even when I stopped attacking him on purpose.  He eventually got plinked to death by an Apprentice Poisoner.
 
It never dawned on me that Thorathian Monolith continues to work even if you change size that round.  I have images of Tiny Sky-Scraper bouncing up and down shouting, "Hit me!  Hit me!" in a tiny piping voice.

Wow, guys, well done. That is one of the quickest unlocks yet.

Huzzah indeed!

In the same turn...does that mean inside a single heroes turn? Or over the course of the entire hero turn?

I imagine her doing the Ant-Man thing, bouncing about as she pushing away punches and twisting weapons out of enemy hands…

A single hero's turn, not the entire round.  There's no such thing as "the entire hero turn."

Curious, since Baron Blade is one of the few villains that is also a Team Villain, can you unlock using Vengeance Baron Blade?

The Environment turn and Villain turn also count as potential 'valid turns' for switching between the three sizes, not just the Hero turns.

You can't get the unlock with Mad Bomber Blade, so I'm fairly certain Vengeance won't work either.  It's easy for someone yet to get the unlock to test, though.  You just have to win a battle against him with Sky-Scraper on the team.  If the Valid turns info shows up in the log, then he would work.

Generally the conditions are pretty specific and would say "regular" Baron Blade if a specific form is required.  Either "regular" is missing, or he should be unlockable with any Baron Blade.

I just got around to doing this.

At first I was a bit baffled as to how to do the tiny / normal / huge thing in one turn, but what worked regularly for me was Argent Adept with the Lyra ( Harmony / Rhythm ) with Alacritous Subdominant (one hero plays 1 card) and Inventive Preparation (one player other than you plays 1 card). Then it’s easy - depending on her starting state, play 2 cards that flip her to the other 2 sizes.

For environment Wagner Mars Base has the meteor storm. Once it’s up you can wait forever to draw the correct cards and play them. Of course you have to flip Baron Blade first, since his front side has a timer.

If you include Parse on the team, you can build up enough Critical Multiplier bonuses that you can eliminate the Baron the turn you take down the meteor storm.