Green Ronin, makers of Mutants and Masterminds, will be teaming up with GtG to make a standalone card game called Sentinels of Earth-Prime https://greenronin.com/blog/2017/02/14/press-release-green-ronin-and-greater-than-games-team-up-for-sentinels-of-earth-prime/
According to the release it will be published by Green Ronin and is supposed to be compatible with SotM
What?
I really don't know how I feel about this.
Wow.
This is new, and interesting. I know that only a few people know but I'm curious if they be new decks, how the rules will work, and how it differs from a new expansion if it's compatible.
We will find out more soon I hope.
This was my reaction as well
Hmm...so it's like Sentinels-but-not and the two games' decks can work with each other? Sounds...interesting?
+1 to the club of unsure reaction
I think that this is an interesting idea. From what I understand of the article, they're taking the M&M world and SotM-ifying it(in terms of making it into a card game), and if you really want, you'd be able to swap in any of the existing SotM decks?
As a fan of the M&M setting, this intrests me...
I look forward to details in the future and seeing what develops from this.
Also, what does this mean in terms of the video game?
Ooooo, I didn't think about that… Probably a bit early to think about it. Would be cool to see Centurion and Captain Thunder in videogame form, though. 
It’s M&M-flavored SotM. It’ll be fine.
I know very little about Mutants and Masterminds… I get the feeling I will soon be learning a whole lot about Mutants and Masterminds. Put me in the excited camp.
Also, this seems like a really smart way to expand the fanbase of both games.
+1
Yeah, this is my thoughts, also. 
I feel exactly the same. I thought it was kind of a questionable decision to put an end their flagship product (and admitedly expected it to come around in some form or another). I'm eager to see how it will turn out!
Feels like a good solution. Seems to me Christopher and Adam want to progress the sentinels story using the RPG as a different system and they can still continue the card game using a the M&M theme.
I'm probably going to treat this like the Cerberus Engine or Legendary: it's modular content that can be either interweaved for interesting shenanigans (hey, there's Marvel characters fighting on The Serenity!), but mostly intended to play entirely separately from each other and give people who don't necessarily like the original theme a way to dive into the system (I usually do the same thing with fan expansions from BGG, both for Sentinels and other games). Just hope it doesn't go the way of these systems where they get over-bloated with themed expansions that it dilutes the meaning of the original.
Looking forward to seeing more before I make a final judgment, but optimistic for more Sentinels gameplay!
Let's just hope everyone gives this new venture a chance, and we avoid the "It's not Sentinels, so I don't like it! Hmph!" mentality. Especially durring the Kickstarter.
Christopher did give me this reply on Reddit about concerns this might impact OblivAeon and the upcoming RPG https://www.reddit.com/r/sentinelsmultiverse/comments/5u0iay/press_release_green_ronin_and_greater_than_games/ddqlvj6/
So it's M&M-themed Sentinels decks, or a completely different game? It's very unclear about that. I'll admit, I don't know much about M&M lore despite having played it, but I'm all for more Sentinels decks, if that's the case!
I read it that it's like Cauldron but set in M&M world owned by Green Ronin
Good enough!
(I think Cauldron's a lot better when mixed with SOTM anyway, so...)
Sentinels of Earth-Prime, a new version of the hugely successful Sentinels of the Multiverse card game using the core setting of the Mutants & Masterminds RPG.
So yeah, looks like Cauldron, but by Green Ronin and, more importantly, with Christopher's input. That's a critical point--I'm familiar with Green Ronin from their d20 products, which are among the best of the 3rd-party d20 products but still nowhere as good as the actual D&D ones. But I trust Christopher, so depending on how involved he is, this would either be a "must buy" or a "wait and see" for me.
Well, this looks promising.
I've been a fan of M&M since I playtested the first edition, and currently (well on hiatus) I've got an M&M Cosmic game going, sort of like a cross between Green Lantern Corps and Guardians of the Galaxy.
We even have an intelligent talking animal (although I don't think that the parallel with Rocket Raccoon was intended).
Anyway, I'm going to back this if at all possible. I look forward to seeing Earth Prime in card format.
This morning I've just been thinking about all the M&M characters I've made (like, two, but still) and now I'm all excited. Granted, my actual experiences playing the RPG aren't gonna have anything to do with this, but the human mind is a strange and silly thing.
If only they could modulize power sets and let you build characters out of module decks of say 10 cards each.
Or something. It totally would not work.
But playing a M&M game would make me want my M&M characters, not their ones that I never played as.
I know Christopher has stated that making different characters with similar power sets is fun, but there is so much overlap and I never got into their characters, mostly because RPG NPCs are very stereotyped and kind of bland.
The best part of SotM isn't Christopher's design talent, although he is really good, it is the storytelling. His characters are ones I like better than the ones on the comic book shelves.
Christopher turning someone else's story into mechanics doesn't seem nearly as promising.
Meh.
Not sure I will buy into this new set, Mutants & Masterminds is a fine RPG system but I have never once looked at the setting material for it.
100% agree with all you said. Modular decks would be a fantastic way to breath new life in SotM and would totally make sense considering the source material is an RPG book (if I understand correctly). For me too, the worldbuilding and storytelling part of the SotM product line is at least half the enjoyment. I really want to give this upcoming game chance though.
M&M has alot of setting and history to it, enough to fill several whole books on the subject! I would spend hours just reading through them, getting familiar with the world and characters and enjoying all the work and possibilities they provided for play. There's more than enough there for Green Ronin to make some awesome decks.
One thing I've been wondering: Would Adam be making the art, or is that left up for the artists at GR?
Christopher said on the Reddit thread that the artwork is on Green Ronin
Put me down for excited. Any chance to get more licenses on this, if done well, I fully support and look forward to. I don't know much about the setting, but I knew nothing about the Sentinels setting going in to the card game either. I'm looking forward to learning more about it.
Now if Handelabra incorporates this into their game they can just take my money now as well.
The more I think about this the less convinced I am that I am going to buy this. Part of what I love about Sentinels is not the game, but learning the story as we went along, I can't see M&M doing that given it's based on an existing property.
While I've grown to really enjoy the Sentinels lore, what hooked me initially was the gameplay, so I've got no issue with a new game using the SOTM mechanics even if I'm not familiar with the new lore. My only real "worry" is that this new game distracts development time/attention away from games already set in the Sentinels universe, but since Chris has already said (on reddit) that's not an issue, I guess I'm fine. And if this new game's success helps enable GtG to continue making great games (which includes a new SOTM-style game), then count me as excited!
Ah, that's neat. Lots of cool and fun art in the M&M Books, so I'm eager to see what they come up with.
I'm with dprcooke--the characters in SotM grew on me after a while, but it's the mechanical aspects of the game that got me interested to that point. I'm sure the M&M heroes and villains will grow on me just as much, as long as their mechanics are compelling.
I know M&M has a setting book which probably has a little bit of info on their iconic heroes and villains. Do they have anything else? Novels, comic books, or whatever? If not, then it could easily be the same sort of thing as SotM where you have to infer the story from the flavor text (or from the devs' offhand comments).
I'm going to wait for more information before getting hyped for this. Like Matchstickman the lore is what really got me invested in Sentinels of the Multiverse. I do enjoy the mechanics, that's what got me so into the lore. I know nothing about Mutants and Masterminds, I have never played it and do not see it occurring in the near future. Now if it was a Champions game in the SotM style then I would totally be on board with the hype. I would totally love to have the Freedom Five and The Champions teaming up to face off against the big bads.
I feel neutrally. I got into Sentinels as a board game, but then I came to love the characters and lore. I suppose I’m glad that the mechanisms will continue to see fresh development, but as it is one of the things I really love about Sentinels is how unique it is. It stands alone among board games.
M&M/Freedom City has multiple setting books in all three M&M editions.
Many of what would seem to be more generic books (like the Cosmic book, for example) have setting material included.
I'm kind of surprised people are "meh" about this, but oh well.
I feel like this as well.
Christopher's storytelling and worldbuilding is a huge part of the attraction of the game for me, and as much as I like the mechanics I'm just not really interested in another superhero IP.
I'm not really interested in superheroes in general, tbh. I have played M&M and enjoyed it, but that's with self-generated characters which makes a lot of difference to me.
Even if this wasn't being made with tried and true game mechanics, headed by a great designer like Christopher, or made with an IP that's pleased an entire swath of fans for around a decade, I'd still buy this on account of wanting to support GTG and encourage them to try new things.
And for those of you who are hesitant because it's not going to be the SotM lore(note the "Hmph!" mentality I mentioned earlier in this thread), try giving one of the M&M books a read. You might be pleasantly surprised.
Like, one thing I think that both Sentinels of the Multiverse and Mutants & Masterminds have in common is that to some extent they're love letters to superhero media. If that shines through with Sentinels of Earth Prime (and I would be surprised if it didn't) it will have its own appeal.
I'll happily buy this to support both >Games and Green Ronin. I've been into M&M since 1st edition, and while I mostly used custom settings I do like some of their characters. More importantly it's more options for game nights. If it is truly compatible with SOTM it's a win-win. More things to add on to our fun little game. Heck, I bought The Cauldron for more options, why wouldn't I buy this?
My mindset is "more to love." I look forward to it, with mild anticipation.
The Cauldron, for me at least, would not be a good selling point. I just couldn't get passed the artwork or some of the hero concepts. I respect the attempt, but it just wasn't for me.
The artwork for M&M has been pretty phenomenal and the heroes I've read about so far seem pretty interesting. I don't think I'll be mixing and matching sets though. It might be a little jarring having two completely different art styles at the table. Plus I was never a huge fan of the big comic cross-over events like DC and Marvel.
I'll wait on final judgement when they launch the Kickstarter. I'm intrigued at the least to see it but it won't be something I instantly click to pledge for without looking it over.
I agree with Powerhound 2000. I look forward to the Kickstarter and what the game entails.
I like the idea and I am excited to see a non Sentinels Comics version. However, I know nothing about M&M so I cannot comment on the universe and I have no idea what characters to expect.
Oho! Well, as someone whose games departed from canon a long time ago, and who tragically only enjoys a handful of the Cauldron heroes, having more high-quality grist for the character mill is always an upside.
Besides which, although I never stayed very close to M&M canon either, there are a handful of characters I am very curious to see them tackle. As a design challenge, the executions for a second each Batman and Flash could be cool... but I am really excited to see what we get for Doctor Metropolis. The spirit of a city, which fights by animating objects? That sounds like a pretty radical Hero deck.
On the villain side, I hope that we get at least one character who is more of a tribute to 60's-style excess than really fit into SotM - someone like Dr. Simian, Baron Samedi, or Captain Kraken (yes, these characters are exactly what you think they are) to balance out the obvious Dr. Stratos and Overshadow.
I'm excited, but only if it integrates well with the existing card game. I like the fact that Christopher will be involved. I'm not big into the whole Cauldren thing, but would be excited to see an official expansion, even if it set in a different universe.
You had me at Dr. Simian.
…Y'know, every now and then I come up with "Doctor Metropolis" when trying to think of Doctor Manhattan's name.
I forgot that was a real character. And now I remember his deal. And I am very excited, right alongside you. 
I'm interested in how they'd tackle characters like Bowman. I've always been a fan of the more traditional super archer myself, an athletic person who uses both quick thinking and a dead-eye aim with an arsenal of special trick arrows to take down villains. I know we have an archer already, but you've got to admit that she's far from a traditional super hero archer.
I'm excited to see what Christopher and the guys from Green Ronin come up with! :)
Likewise. It's doubly funny, because Metropolis' nemesis is Hiroshima, who - well, I guess people can figure out that whole deal.
Regarding Cauldron comparisons, I don't wish to downplay that community. I am a firm believer in fan-made expansions to board games, and have a few custom SotM decks, myself. But, at the same time, it's hard to duplicate that extra level of polish that months of playtesting and years of experience designing things for this game, specifically, can bring. I certainly see a huge uptick in quality between most of the early heroes and the more recent ones (so much so, I would actually love to buy a "Sentinels remastered," with the original ten heroes and four villains reworked to integrate some of the design lessons of the last five years), so as a student of design, getting to see that refinement continue to play out is a big selling point for me.
Ah, and I'd love to see a deck for Whoop-Ant and his team too! Gotta love teen heroes and the dynamics they can provide!
Thanks for mentioning Whoop-Ant, that the distinct character name I needed to start finding resources (the wiki and Freedom City Encyclopedia).
Looking through stuff, what I'd really like to see is:
Thanks for linking those; I just did my own wiki dive, and there's some cool stuff in their mythos I'd like to see done.
Given what I've seen, I've got two pretty safe predictions I'm going to make on the release.
1) Since the box is meant to be standalone, it should have similar breakdown to the current Sentinels core box (10 heroes, 4 villains, 4 environments).**
2) M&M has their own version of The Sentinels; I expect at least half of the heroes in the set to comprise members of this list. (Maybe founding members)
** Given the statements of the two products being combined, I would guess hero decks need to be substitutable. Beyond that? Could be completely different play modes for everything else, so those numbers are up in the air. But if they're copying the engine verbatim, then I would expect it to match the core game.
Really? The Sentinels?
That's possible, and could be interesting due to some more off-beat members, but my first thought was - as you also assume - we were probably looking at 10 Heroes and 4 Villains… and there are 10 members of The Freedom League. So, the core set seems liable to heavily feature them, with maybe one or two skipped over (most likely Star Knight - the League is pretty heavy on "Flying Brick" types, and she's even the secondary powered armor person) to work in some designer favorite(s). My vote for that slot would be Lantern Jack, but a teen hero or Sentinel may be more likely.
For villains, I still think Stratos and Overshadow will be there right out the gate. Omega is trickier - he's the highest-profile villain, but conceptually similar enough to Oblivaeon that they may want to hold off. My wish list is mentioned above, though I'll add The Collective. Christopher may wish to do Dr. Sin, if he has any leftover ideas from a Zhu Long concept which never quite got made (I may be projecting here).
I just REALLY want at least ONE insect/bug themed hero as an official Sentinels deck…
Sentinels of the Multiverse didn’t feature a team with “sentinels” in their name until the 5th (?) expansion. I hardly think the fact that Sentinels of Earth Prime uses a similar name to the original game means it will feature the team that happens to be names “Sentinels” in that universe.
Wasn’t aware of Freedom League during my wiki dive, so I read The Sentinels as the main group of heroes when I found them. And as mentioned by Ironic, Sentinels also has 10 members, so it sounded right to me.
Either way, there’s a couple heroes from that group that I’d like to see (Princess looks like a fun take on tanks and reminds me a lot of a Young Legacy without laser eyes)
Sorry for being wrong on the internet, guys. 
Subject yourself to 3 memes and a Rick Roll, and you shall be forgiven.
No, Bobber, this is my bad. I shouldn't have been so dismissive, it's just that my perspective is a little different.
I focus on the League, because I played M&M in the early 2000s, when (1) that team, and the Freedom City setting it represents, was the clear focus of the line, and (2) neither Emerald City nor its Sentinels existed yet. But 3rd edition introduced Emerald City as the new Center Of Everything, which was probably a good call, since most of its stuff is less directly a shout-out to assorted existing properties. Viewed in that light, some Emerald City Sentinels material is more or less gaurenteed - though I am still hoping for a mix of both editions.
The League people I most want to see are Metropolis (did I mention that I like Dr. Metropolis?) and Daedalus (because I like powered armor, but hate Bunker's deck); meanwhile, the Sentinels who speak to me are Vortex (teleportation!), and Dragoneye (surely, there is a lot of fertile ground in a "spells and incorporeality" character without Nightmist's "chaos and self-damage" theme). And I hope that we get either Xeno or Pseudo, for some more open-ended shapeshifting than Naturalist has, though both of them would likely be overkill.
I don't really know anything about the Emerald City villains, so I have less to add on that front.
Definitely interested to see what the kickstarter for Earth Prime will offer! Love the Sentinels engine! Also love and play The Cauldron all the time - Matthew Bishop did a wonderful job with countless hours of work put into it. Much respect!
If I was curious about the Cauldron and wanted to look into it, where could I check it out?
Thank you. Is there any history behind it, or any kind of lore I could look up?
It's the same principle as Sentinels, comics from a universe we don't inhabit. But you could do worse than look here
Matthew has the bios on the above lined homepage through Oriphel.
There isn't a lot of history to it, like there wouldn't ever be a letters page level of information and story, that isn't how the Cauldron was created.
I know basically nothing about Mutants and Masterminds, but if this means more Sentinels (in gameplay, if not as far as lore is concerned) then I'm on board!
Mutants and Masterminds is largely a setting-neutral RPG for playing superheroes. It has its own default setting (Freedom City/Earth Prime) which has a lot in common with Sentinels of the Multiverse, at least in terms of what both set out to do (which is to produce material that feels like superhero comic books - the two are very different in execution).
It has enough setting I think to support a game like this, and we'll get to see similarly powered characters treated differently to distinguish them from each other (both settings have paragons (Superman-like powers), blasters, speedsters, etc. But how each one will be expressed will fit each hero and won't derive from Sentinels of the Multiverse characters so much (Adam was quoted as saying something similar above).
I'm looking forward to it because more decks, more options, more fun. :)
Question: when they say standalone game does that mean can be played by itself or they r not going to do any expansions for it
Usually the term refers to the former.
And the latter almost certainly depends on how well it sells.
Wow.
Just two weeks before the kickstarter launches? That is amazingly fast, I might even go so far as to say too fast.
http://greenronin.com/blog/2017/04/03/ronin-roundtable-sentinels-of-earth-prime-card-game-coming-to-kickstarter-this-month/
confused by what you mean Matchstick.
i am kinda excited for this but I will have to wait until it hits FLGS most likely due to baby. Unless the price is right and I can beg my wife
Well Morp, no one knew this even existed 2 months ago. When I budget for gaming expenses I like to be able to get a feel for the game and mull it over for a good while before I make a decision on it, there has been no release of info, no tease of art or mention of characters that will be included until today. 2 weeks does not give me enough time to really dig into the material and see if there is anything there. And it is rare for me to come back when a campaign is in full swing and check out if anything has changed and possibly pledge if it doesn't wow in the opening pitch.
Yeah I'd like more teaser information than what has been released so far.
I don't know about you, but I'm not really plugged in to the relevant streams. Paul earlier indicated that this is primarily a Green Ronin game related to Mutants and Masterminds, and I don't hang out on the relevant forums. There may have been more updates there?
Oh dang, this is exciting though.
I'm never going to have money again. D:
I'm a little confused by this approach. You want to know that the campaign is going to start well in advance so you can research it and be ready to pledge on day 1? That's not really the intended model. Kickstarter is designed such that you read the pitch and have the full campaign period, usually a month or so, to do whatever research you want and then pledge. So I'd think of it less that you have 2 weeks to get ready for the campaign, and more that you have about 6 weeks to do all the research and then pledge when you're ready as long as it hasn't closed yet.
In other news, looking at that article, it seems that while the heroes use the same general design template as SotM, the villains and environments are replaced by events, specifically invasions (for now). That's pretty cool–the new "villains" might be designed more like, say, the Dreamer, or Miss Information's and Kaarga's front sides, or, more loosely, like Wager Master when you're forbidden to beat him by HP loss. Less "big sack of HP you have to deplete" and more "specific tasks/challenges you need to complete". I like that a lot and it would be a pretty big draw for me.
I'm not confused by Matchstickman's stance. This is a game being built upon an already existing system and could immediately get SotM excited about it but very little detail on what they are planning for has been released towards this audience. I'm not sure what may have been said on their own site forums but it seems strange that they haven't reached out to these forums at all.
Not sure I agree with any of that (and basically in the same camp as MindWanderer). They've made two press releases, given a date on when the Kickstarter will launch, and from the second annoucement gave a glimpse into the content that'll be included (10 heroes/4 villains/4 environments, gave a good idea on the heroes that'll be included by mentioning the freedom league, confirmed it's going to integrate with Sentinels content). About the only thing they haven't shown is what it'll look like and the exact content, and I'm sure that's being saved for the campaign itself.
And as MindWanderer said, you basically have from now until the campaign closes to decide if it's for you or not. Until then, I'm not sure why anyone should feel entitled to be told anything just because it's the Sentinels system with a different coat of paint. In the same way GTG would launch a Sentinels product and choose what information they reveal and when, why should we expect something different from Green Ronin?
Frankly, I'm more surprised that Paul, Mara, Christopher, et al have been mostly mum about this project in their own community. In the same vein that Green Ronin could be telling us about it, I'm sure they could be drumming up interest in their own community. "Sad to see the Multiverse go? Well, here's more content to play with!" Instead, we're getting a case of the announcements being found by the community itself. That's a real shame in my book.
What you stated is a lot of my point in that what information we have gotten is mostly from these press releases and nothing further. If it weren't for the community posting them we might not have any idea about this before the KS. This feels along the same lines as the Foam Brain Game KS for Sentinel Comics merchandise where they launched them without really even letting the main audience for it about it. I think it's a big miss on their part and GtG's not to reach out to these forums themselves about this.
Paul, Mara, and Christopher may be mum due to some kind of gag order? With it being a deal between two companies they may have a contract saying who can say what when. Again I am interested in the product due to my love of SoTM but would love more details to decide if it's a must buy now or wait till it hits FLGS. Especially with money being tight
If that is true, it would be a rather silly marketing decision IMO. Sentinels of Earth-Prime, while sharing thematic and gameplay DNA with SotM, simply does not carry the same prestige in these circles. One could say that SotM's best feature is the lore and world-building that comes with every new release and the anticipation that built over a long history of releases and years of teasers. Earth-Prime, being a relatively obscure product in these circles, will simply not create the same level of excitement by a mere mention of its name. So IMO, Earth-Prime WILL require lots more buzz, at least outside the Earth-Prime circles, to achieve similar levels of success. However, I do feel the lack of ongoing marketing is not GtG's new thing - I have always felt many of their own non-SotM products could benefit from a lot more buzz!
You don't get to decide what the Kickstarter model is, nor do I (nor does Kickstarter unlesss they enforce it). I don't think the Kickstarter was designed for being used as a pre-order system for games that have already been produced, but companies do use it that way. Kickstarter is as it is used.
Now, I also think that the Kickstarter is not going to get the overlap from the Sentinels community it might have done because although it's not being done by the same company, >G have the OblivAeon kickstarters outstanding and I am reluctant to back a thing that I perceive as coming from the same place as one that still owes me something, and I know others that subscribe to the same "irrationality" that I do.
Absolutely. But I love superheroes, and I love Mutants & Masterminds and I do travel in RPG circles, and I've heard nothing but the two press releases, not teases, not leaks, not speculation from fans on their forums. It's not a great start (from an outsiders perspective at least).
When will the kickstarter start this week?
Hmm So Sentinels with be getting more Heroes or is this there take on it.
I am Saturated wtih that we have now. I do not get to play enough to play all the heroes even if I wanted to. I though about getting Cauldren But my the total wieght of SOTM is more than all my other games, and takes more space. Going to look at the kick starter and see how I like it. Maybe an intersting hero might change my mind.
Its fully compatible, same designer different artist and publisher.
Basically it's a new starter in a different comic universe.
Kickstarter is up!
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1780208966/sentinels-of-earth-prime
Dangit, why did the Goon RPG Kickstarter have to come so close on the start of this one?! good thing I'm getting paid this week...
I had hoped the KS might have a bit more information to it. I'm still at the same point of being uncertain whether I truly want this or not.
They listed all 10 hero decks, the 4 villains, who's taking charge of what portion of development, a whole swath of stretchgoals off the bat...
What kind of info are you wanting?
Background of these heroes and villains. What environments and their story. What kind of alterations they plan on making since I doubt this would be exactly like the core SotM game.
There's loads of fiction on each of these characters easily accessible that they probably didn't get into because they wanted to get all the important stuff out of the way.
They list the environments in the same place where they announced all the other decks. The environments are Freedom City(the standard version of Metropolis), Farside(Gotham, if I'm not mistaken. I probably am.) City, Tartarus(Self-explanitory), and The Terminus(I'm having trouble with this one, haven't read up on it in a bit).
As for alterations and such, I think they'll either cover that in updates(hasn't funded yet, so let's give them some time) or possibly leave that for players to discover. Don't want to tip your hand right out the gate, right?
How many alterations do you think are probable or even possible if it's designed to be interchangable with all current SotM products?
As far as story and character lore, this universe has material dating back to 2002 that are probably accesible easily to read up on. It's an RPG based universe so there are likely countless source books
Personally I'm looking forward to finding out about the new characters and so on the same way I found about the Sentinels Comics ones. :)
I'm really glad they put in an RPG-focused pledge tier. I like the idea and wanted to help towards a digital version but just have no use for offline geek board games any time soon... but on the other hand I totally love reading through RPG sourcebooks.
Christopher has kept coming up with ones with each expansion that wouldn't have occurred to me with each expansion. I also don't think it's too much to ask for some bachground on these heroes within the KS. You're trying to appeal to two groups and a lot won't know anything about the other. You'll also have people who no background in any of it who you should entice as well if you can. here. At this point there still isn't enough present that excites me enough to make this an instant buy in. Maybe some of the updates during the campaign will change my mind.
I am in the same boat as Powerhound_2000 (funny how life has lots of boats without hired security). +1 more detailed background on the Earth-Prime characters.
I have a feeling this will be done in the updates. However I do agree with you some more detail would be nice. I would also like to know how they plan to make sure hero A in Multiverse who is similar to hero A in earth-prime do not become the same deck play style. I would like to see some differences.
I found the Earth-Prime heroes to be more generic than I expected. I don't see them being compelling enough to make me want to play them over the multitude of SotM decks I've already got, many of which I really love playing but which don't get enough playtime because of the sheer number of fun decks to choose from on game night. Maybe the Earth-Prime heroes have some super compelling backstory I don't know yet, but I doubt I'll be backing the KS.
Christopher is covering that part of development, so I'm sure that he'll be able to make each deck feel different.
I'm not a M&M expert, but so far it looks like the Heroes are like (correct me if I am wrong)
Bowman: Arrow, Hawkeye, Parse
Captain Thunder: Superman + Electricity
Daedalus: Greek Gravity Suit Ironman
Dr. Metropolis: Can control and shape urban enviorments, sounds very cool!
Johnny Rocket: Speedster/Tacheon
Lady Liberty: Not sure, Wonder Women vibe?
Pseudo:Shape-shifting telepath
The Raven: Batman/Wraith
Siren: Aquatic and sonic powers, Aquaman + Banshee?
Star Knight: Space Iron Man
So there is only a couple crossovers, and even some of the Sentinel versions (like Parse, nothing like Arrow/Hawkeye) are not like the Marvel/DC inspitarions.
I got a "Martian Manhunter but painted red" vibe from that one.
Insta-backed, I cannot wait to play Dr. Metropolis. :D
I mean, he's literally all I remember about the M&M backstory stuff, but I don't care, more decks!
It is a bit odd they don't have the shipping cost upfront as that might turn some people away as they have to budget for it. Then again having it upfront might turn people away depending where you are from it might be unreasonably high for them.
I imagine the details on the heroes, et al, will be updates during the campaign – it's the same thing Greater Than Games did, if I remember correctly. We'll get the details over the course of the campaign.
It's the new way to manage the uncontrollable around shipping.
more than likely they may have a new route of shipping and dont way to say until confirmed? The other thing that could be going on is they need time.
Nobody has asked the important question yet: Will it fit in the Collector's Case with everything else?
Seriously, that's actually a major factor for me in deciding whether or not I buy it.
The collectors case is just for SotM stuff. If unsleeved it might all fit in that box.
While it can probably fit if you don't sleeve, I doubt it will if you do sleeve. This is probably just the start, if we at some point in the future get anywhere near the amount of decks we already have for SotM then it for sure won't all fit. This is not just some expansion for SotM, it could be the start of a whole line of games.
Ah, yes. Because it is very difficult to create different play styles for heroes whose powers are primarily super strength and superior durability (Haka, VG Mainstay, Legacy), or shooting wanted criminals with cool guns (Expat, ChronoRanger), or creating any shape they can visualize (Captain Cosmic, VG Idealist), or relying on combat training and cool gadgets (Wraith, Stuntman, Luminary ), or striking with the power of the elements (Ra, Tempest).
Very difficult indeed.
Bummed that the digital verion is a $400K stretch goal. Seemes like this would be a no brainer to do.
It may be a no-brainer, but it's hardly a no-cost-er!
You've proven its doable. That doesn't mean it isn't difficult. =P
I hope to have earned at least a little faith in my ability to design decks for this game...
I'm honestly disappointed at how many female characters are barely clothed. 
But that's a separate issue…
How much input did you have in the decks that were designed for this game? That would go a long way towards whether I will pledge for this or not.
I am the designer of this game. I have 100% input in the decks designed for this game.
Ok. That much was not clear to me. I thought this was a case where they designed the decks and you gave your thoughts/critiques on them.
I'm excited to get decks you design. What I'm less sure of is getting characters you didn't write. I mean, Mr. Fixer is cool. Is there anyone that cool in M&M? As loveable as Unity? As fun as Guise?
That's not up to me! That said, the writer - Steve Kenson - has a lot of great stories.
I pledged now but this was certainly part of my hesitation as this isn't Christopher and Adam's story/characters.
You're making the decks? Now I am seriously contemplating whether I want to get it or not.
I suspect that a printer in China is making the decks.
I’ll go away now.
I'm surprised to hear that you have the time to design 10+4 new decks given the RPG and Tactics will be competing for your attention as well.
What spiffy said. Do not neglect the RPG!
On and Tatics as well I guess. They been waiting longer than I have. I might even join in wave 2. Might have spare money then.
I need to do research on M&M. I love learning about new RPG systems. Short on money but if I like it I will back this.
Personally I'm supportive of this idea as it lets Greater Than Games keep going/diversify as a business while at the same time still getting to promote Sentinels. They have a great mechanics system to go with the great content; they might as well get to profit from it.
I realize we all love Sentinels, but I'm guessing GTG doesn't want (and probably literally can't afford) to become a one-trick pony.
If GtG is going to branch out with the card game, I'd personally rather they do something a little different-er. I've already got boxes full of superhero decks. I don't need more of those. But a card game in another genre which is based on the SotM engine but which adds the ability for space marines to swap between vehicles during a fight, or a card game that's a tournament between martial artists using various fighting styles, or a fantasy card game where my character is commanding an army of orcs/elves/dragons... now that's something that gets me excited.
The things about SotM that I would want kept -- gotta be co-op, gotta have a central character for each deck for me to identify with, each deck's gotta feel/play differently from each other. But it doesn't gotta be superheroes. We already have that.
[Edit: a martial arts tournament game would need the ability to PvP against other players, natch. But hopefully it would be, at its core, a co-op game since that's traditionally been SotM's core goodness.]
[Double edit: the more I think about it, the more I desperately want to play these card games. Where's the Kickstarter for these?? Sign me up!]
The mechanics of Sentinels is pretty much geared strongly towards beings who have inherent powers of some type, I feel. So, superhumans, fantasy beings with magic abilities, science heroes/villains with gadgets or genetic or psionic abilities.
And out of the existing properties that fit those various categories with a good already established fanbase (extremely helpful for trying to spread beyond your own existing audience with a new concept) that don't already have their own card game spinoffs in the pipeline (therein lies the kicker; a lot of notable franchises in the tabletop games genre already have their own in-house board games), Mutants and Masterminds is a pretty good first fit IMHO.
Don't forget also that Christopher and Adam clearly have a specific love for superheroes and comics which might influence things.
I linked this earlier, but here it is again:
https://freeronin.com/2e_files/FC-encyclopedia.pdf
So we have:
I'm not really seing this "loads of fiction" you're talking about, at least not online. Of the 4 characters I've looked, up, one didn't bring up any relavant results, 2 brought up the same site with a short wall of text, and the third has the pdf with one-line descriptions and the wiki with one paragraph descriptions. Combined with the fact that some of them have multiple incarnations isn't helping.
I was hoping to see more than a name and a standing portait of each character. Something to sell me on the world.
I can't find much either. They don't seem to have novels or anything. But there is the Atlas of Earth-Prime, and some of their products describe parts of the setting, too. Not seeing "loads," certainly.
I think I'm going to have to pass on this Kickstarter. The card game is full MSRP plus shipping, which could be a lot. The RPG PDF's would be a small draw as a bonus, and they are at a small discount off MSRP ($5 each, or $20 off both if combined with the card game), but for me that's not a deal-maker. Sure, there are promo cards, but just a couple so far. Meh. And the characters seem extremely bland so far. So I'll probably wait for reviews to come out, or maybe even to see a demo at a con, unless later stretch goals include several mini-expansions or something else extremely enticing.
I admit as an RPG fan I find it a little weird to see so many geeks who haven't heard of M&M at all when it's pretty much THE superhero RPG other than Champions.
Chris Pramas said in the comments section that he plans to show off content during the campaign. This is really starting to echo the earlier discussion about "why didn't he drum up interest for the project 2 weeks before he announced the project?" or "they've announced the project is coming? why don't I know everything about it?"
You've got a month to possibly back; there's nothing saying anyone has to commit to SoEP right this second. So, if you're on the fence because of lore, I'd say take a breather and just watch the project.
First, call me old fashioned, but I believe everyone has a right to feel as they do whether I agree with it personally or not.
That said, I don’t understand why not knowing the lore would prevent anyone from buying this expansion. How many people knew anything at all about Legacy or Haka before they purchased the first edition of Sentinels of the Multiverse?
I own every edition and expansion. My friends and I have played the game together dozens of times. They all love it. None of them can tell you anything about the lore at all. They didn’t even know there was lore until I brought it up recently.
Even without knowing the lore, it can be argued that the majority of people in these forums actually know more right now about Sentinels of Earth Prime than they did about the first edition of Sentinels of the Multiverse when it first came out.
Again, while I don’t completely agree with those bringing up not knowing the lore as a reason to pass, I respect your right to hold those opinions.
For me, priorities and life has changed a great deal. Back then I was looking to starting my board game collection that’d be fun for both me and my girlfriend at the time. Not knowing much about board games i chose the most interesting and only Superhero game I saw.
Now, I’m a single father of a 6 year old boy. With a fair amount of board games I don’t have much time to play, not even Sentinels of the Multiverse. Nor do I have a fantastical job that pays me enough to easily support my expensive hobbies. I can no longer just drop $40 in something because I think it’d be nice to have, it needs to be something I know I’ll make too use of. It using the SotM engine certainly put it on my radar, then knowing Christopher will designing it has made into something I’ll consider.
I’m sure it’s going to be great, but right now I’m not sure it’s something that I really feel I need to add to my collection right now.
Entertainingly, I just showed the KS video to my spouse with no context. Her first comment was "So more Sentinels stuff, but different reality." Her second comment was "I can do without some of those costumes, though."
Looking forward to the details Chris shares over the course of the KS!
The only character that would fall under this would be Siren.
Was she refering to the female characters when she said that? Or was that just in general? Johnny Rocket's cycling outfit does look rather silly. 
In all honesty, this is a different company with characters that have 15 years worth of fans. I don't think one bathing suit is gonna taint the whole game. And I doubt we're gonna encourage Green Ronin to have a character put on some pants if they haven't done it since 2002 either.
I'd still vote for encouraging Ronway to finally wear pants even though he hasn't for years. 
That struck me as well, though slightly unfairly now that I check. Three female heroes, one of whom wears a bikini, one a very bare midriff, and all are skin-tight. Base SotM had four female heroes, one of whom wore fitted but not totally unreasonable armor, but honestly, Visionary is pretty bad, Tachyon is about the same as Raven, and Wraith isn't anything to brag about in that department either. It did get better with later expansions, though. I do appreciate the challenge of drawing characters meant to instantly evoke "That's a comic book hero, just not one I'm familiar with" without making them sexualized, since that's what comic book artists do. And no one's exactly mimicing, say, Witchblade.
I'm afraid that is a lost cause, my friend.
Never give up never surrender!
I hoped there'd be more info in the base Kicstarter page, at least some description of the world and characters. The video on the page is clearly marketed towards people who are familiar with the M&M brand, but for those who aren't, it's a bit of a wash.
For me, I bought Sentinels after having played it and falling in love with it. For this though, it has to get over the threshold of me alreadying owning a giant box of comic book characters in this gamemode. I barely get enough time to play Sentinels as is, having an "expansion" that's just a bit different isn't enough of a concept on its own to pull me. Knowing the lore might help persuade me.
The first time I'd ever heard of Sentinels or GTG was when I was looking on Google Play for apps of board games and it was in there with a supervillain as the icon. So I basically said "Ooh, a superhero card game, that's something new, let's give that a spin." That was literally all I knew about the game or GTG.
And that even though I am an on-and-off again Magic fan and familiar with the CCG market in general.
In contrast, I've known about M&M for ages because like I said, it's basically the co-D&D of superhero RPGs along with Champions. I'm not hugely familiar with it because my group was always committed to d20, but I still know more about it than I did initially about Sentinels.
So my first reaction to the news was basically "Oh, awesome, Sentinels being connected to one of the RPG mainstays is a really great score for GTG", and then I go and read the other Sentinels fan reactions and it's like, "…"
As for the costumes, I feel like Lady Liberty's outfit isn't hugely different from Expat or Sky-Scraper's outfit. Siren's is more out there, but I honestly don't really raise eyebrows until we get to stuff like comics Gamora levels of egregriousness.
The project funded as of 9 hours in, so like it or not the Sentinels of Earth-Prime is coming!
The art shown in the kickstarter campaign has very different levels of quality. Some pictures are OK (I don't like the style but it's reasonably well done), but other pictures are quite bad. Especially the shot of the heros flying is not what I call good comic book art.
I wish they showed some actual card examples. On one hand I trust Chris to write good decks (I own all of SotM) and I would like to get them, on the other I dislike the M&M art - especially if some cards have the same low quality as that shot of the heros flying.
-----
About the skimpy outfits, I think the problem is the lack of personality of the outfits. Some girls like to wear sexy skimpy outfit, it's not objectifying per se. I like Vision, you can't really argue she's the stereotypical objectified girl, she's bald for one thing. As much as I dislike sexual objectification, just because the Wraith shows some nice looking cleavage shouldn't be a call to rally for the rights of women. I mean, you can see the abs of Legacy, it's not objectifying per se. The objectification issue is more complex than simply showing a girl in a sexy way (though it's almost a necessary component, it's not sufficient). Otherwise, you're arguing the only correct way to draw a girl is for her to not show any cleavage and so on.
To each his own, I guess. The flying heroes shot would be what I'd expect from a game compatible with SotM. I really grew fond of this particular drawing style. I will agree with you though that some card preview would be really good! 
Does anybody know who the artist will be? Or even if there will be more than one artist?
look at the faces of the women on the right. aren't they almost identical? in fact, their whole body/posture seems a slightly modified copy/paste mirror. the captain american woman, is her waist/mid riff human? I'm awful at drawing yet I think I can do a better job. aren't the speedster guy legs very short? the raven woman on the left, doesn't her face look very masculine?
just curious if you disagree with the above, or you think it's no big deal and it looks sufficiently good.
I think the art of SotM is quite enjoyable and much better than M&M.
As proof of my faith, I made the vow to make at least half of my board game collection to be Sentinels related. I'm almost there…
I am by no means an art expert, and now that you mention it, I can see what you're pointing at. I will say though that I'd be more than satified if the art in SoEP looked like this flying heroes shot. I think what I like about this particular piece is that it is kind of more… coarse? I can certainly say that it "feels" closer to the art in SotM than anything else on the KS page.
Adam's art certainly improved over the years. But if you look at the cards of the base set, you'll agree that the level of details is below this of the flying heroes shot (And yet I love it!).
First, I'm not dissing the product at all, but there's nothing on the KS page that grabs me and shouts at me that I have to back it. I mean I'm not big on superheroes in the first place, but throw me a bit of story and background and you might get my attention.
Right now I'm getting that it's the exact same game as SotM but with characters I don't know. So why do I need it?
And I know that international shipping is the bugbear of everyone's life - I totally get it - but I'm not going to back anything where I don't know how much I'll be spending. Just nope.
That 'flying at the camera' shot is an older piece of artwork, so I don't think it should be thought of as an example of what the game's art will look like.
The Mock-up of the box however, along with the shot of Captain Thunder punching the head off of a Terminus Drone look amazing. Hopefully those artists are being hired for the majority of the game's art!
Hopefully Green Ronin will hear the complaints and give a more backer-friendly answer to the shipping issue further along in the campaign.
Interestingly enough, I'd prefer the older art. The other pieces might be "better", with the real-life level of details, but I just feel like that's what we see everywhere… I might be wrong, but I feel like the art in SotM has its own very unique style.
(Note that I'll probably be happy with whatever ends up on the cards though…! )
Hopefully. But how many potential backers will simply close the page and forget about it?
That's why I always click the 'Remind Me' button on all the KS campaigns I look into. Good way of keeping me up to date. :)
This is what I do, though I wish there was a "follow" button that also emails you when updates happen with the Kickstarter so I know to go read the new info.
I agree with you that the art of SotM is unique and has its own soul, both the earlier drawings and the latest ones. The art on show for M&M looks to me rather generic "comic superhero", drawn with greater or lesser skill and detail. I'm not even a great comic reader anymore and I still immediately recognize Namor, Captain America, the Flash, V. von Doom and a random Roman centurion : )
I just hope we get to see some cards. Even the Infernal Relics and Enhanced ed. kickstarter 5 years ago started off by showing some cards on the 1st day. If I were them, I'd also have done a small AMA here on the forums, for example.
I'm primarily exicted to have more heroes to choose from. I only play a handful of the current heroes myself, though I have played almost all of them at least once. Certain types of heroes and certain mechanics of decks draw me in more than others. Also more villains will be nice to have, Oblivaeon is more a new game mode than a new villain so we haven't had new ones in a while. Think Villains was the set before Oblivaeon and that just added more Vengeance style villains, which I'd still like to play more often. Villains are probably the hardest decks to playtest as they determine the flow of the game and the time it takes to play, which also means you have to basically play the same game over and over to test them. Heroes are easily swapped around and even the environment usually plays a minor role in the overall battle.
Guess I'll chime in.
SO I looked, and like a lot of people here, am not backing. Nothing to do with the product itself - Looks great, looks like it has a lot of great story potential, lot of interesting character possiblities, but for me? Its just duplicating over what I already have, without adding anything new to what I want - And that is Sentinel Comics story. I am -nuts- about the story (though no where near as perceptive about it as some people are) - the story is why I started the wiki in the first place. The story is what keeps me looking through the cards even though I rarely get a chance to play the physical game anymore, the story is what keeps me buying anything and everything Sentinel Comics - and this is Green Ronin Comics (for lack of a better term)
Glad it funded! Hope GtG has a good deal and will make a tidy profit from it. Not something for me, unfortunately.
(Note: I understand that M& M most likely has an amazing story of its own, and will show it off through the card game - but I don't have any interest in it, mostly through reasons of life having its own say on what I get to spend my very limited free time on.)
Phantom5613 wrote:
That's why I always click the 'Remind Me' button on all the KS campaigns I look into. Good way of keeping me up to date. :)
Thar's what the $1 pledge is for. 
True, maybe the handelabra addition should have been an add-on that is unlocked at a lower amount. If we don’t hit the $400K hopefully Handelabra can find a way to make it happen.
I never did the cauldron thing so maybe I am still more hungry for new decks than other people here. So I backed it.
Having said that I would really like to see Tactics get finished. It is my daughter’s favorite game. She has even made her own characters for it for a school project. No prompts from me. I didn’t even know she was doing it.
I just asked on the KS page about the art. I see several very different art styles, presumably from different artists, and I'm curious which one will be in the card game. They have different approaches to, eg, how to represent the female characters.
I'm pleased that at least none of them succumbed to the ridiculous boobs-and-butt pose. I have a friend that was able to reproduce that pose in a photo; it looked extraordinarily uncomfortable.
The one-sentence description of Dr. Metropolis sounds fantastic. Looking forward to learning more about a hero that is a city come to life.
Are you familiar with Jim C Hines' efforts from a few years back to reproduce assorted fantasy/SF and romance cover poses?
I am! Those are fantastic.
Backing was pretty much a no-brainer for me - or rather, I'd already decided to back this when the news first broke.
I love Sentinels of the Multiverse, and it is probably my favorite tabletop game (although not the one I've spent the most money on). I love Mutants & Masterminds, both the game and the world-building that's gone into the Earth-Prime setting, and I've stuck with it since I playtested the first edition some 15 years ago (holy crap). I totally understand that it's not for everyone, so that's fine. I do expect the product to turn out rather well.
Part of international shipping problems are the incredibly unstable world of international shipping.
They've added an FAQ question about it, and yeah, nothing.
the choice is you can tell people a number and then eat anything that goes above that, or charge actual shipping charges, which have been changing unpredictibly.
I think it was just confirmed that the KS campaign is EU Friendly, for those concerned about it. :)
I backed it.
I'm at an odd place. I like the game design of Mutants and Masterminds. It's one of my favorite RPGs even if I don't play or run it as often as I want. I still generate characters for it whenever I'm bored. All that said, I'm only lukewarm on the setting. I like Clairemont Academy, I kinda like their heroes, I do like their villians. Honestly, I just want more options for my SOTM nights. I picked up the Cauldron once it was presented in a way that GtG got a slice of that pie as well.
I'd say I most looking forward to Bowman as I want a more "traditional" Archer Hero deck to play. I just got Handelabra's email about what they hope to happen with the digital game. I really hope they make it happen.
I really really hope they show some cards preview before the end of the campaign too. It seems that more than a few people want to know how SotM and SoEP will compare aesthetically. GtG attention to details is a very important part of why I like SotM so much…
agreed. I see this being more doable for Handelabra though in a year or so after Green Ronin does an expansion
Hey all,
Another update finally hit late tonight on the SoEP kickstarter. Looks like we will start getting story updates there soon.
I will agree even though I am in the states, not knowing those shipping prices ahead of time is a gamble but I completely understand. A small company can not eat costs like that. I am hoping they can give those of you not in the US a better estimate of what it will be before hand, even if they have to say hey this is what the price would be now to give you a rough idea but its most likely going to go up in a year.
I guess for myself, I am getting it just to get more decks to play with. I enjoy SoTM too much and want to keep playing. Its one of the reasons I am hoping to buy the Cauldron in the next few months. Would love to know more about the world of M&M but I never have time or the people to play RPGs with so I am not to interested in that at the time.
I'm backing this initial project, because I'm always down for more heroes, villains, and environments. Based on the quality of the initial product, I might continue to support SoEP as a whole (assuming there are expansions, etc). I think a lot will depend on whether or not they use their own playtesters or ours. If they release out-of-whack with the current SotM decks, then it'll be a one trial learning experience for me.
For that to be possible, that would mean that Christopher was spending time creating SoEP cards instead of working on OblivAeon cards. That would make me sad, if it were true.
It would not mean that. Christopher can't be spending 100% of his time working on OblivAeon cards, because they need to be playtested.
I backed as well, but I really considered holding off until I found out who is playtesting, that’s a huge factor for me as well.
He's playtesting OblivAeon right now too, right? I'm just saying that unless he spent a bunch of time creating SoEP decks before he turned his attention to finishing OblivAeon (which would be its own kind of sadness), spending time now to create cards to reveal on their kickstarter wouldn't really qualify as him having 100% of his attention on OblivAeon. And if he's not working on Oblivaeon, he should probably be working on Tactics, the other super late GtG Kickstarter people (like me) have already paid for, before he's working on a brand new KS for another company.
I'm not trying to cause trouble, I'm just hoping that focus can be maintained by GtG on their own late products before they spend time on someone else's.
I think Christopher has gone on record on the Reddit page saying that this project won't cut into his OblivAeon time.
I can't speak directly for GTG or Christopher, but in any industry where you are working on projects/products, there is a pipeline of things happening at different stages. If you spend 100% of your time on the immediate very next thing, the pipeline can go dry and you end up with idle time (at best; at worst, going out of business). New projects have to get started while current projects are in production, it's just a fact of life.
I understand what you're saying, though as a person who has paid hundreds of dollars for products which don't yet exist, it doesn't make me happy. I would prefer one finished project to several incomplete ones.
I forget where, but didn't Christopher say he won't even start working on SoEP until OblivAeon is at the printers?
Now THAT's focus! I like it.
Cue angst over Tactics.
(I'm kidding, Tactics requires more playtesting than design, because there are a ton fewer cards, and you need different styles of players playing each character.)
I'm excited to see how the archer works, and really interested in Dr. Metropolis, whose power set is unlike anything in SotM. Also interested in the way Christopher makes Johnny Rocket distinct from Tachyon. Should be cool.
Also, as a creator, Christopher faces a certain risk of burnout if he focuses on a single project for too long without breaks. Turning his attention to other projects may actually be to OblivAeon’s benefit, as it gives him a chance to refresh himself.
Dr. Metropolis will present an interesting challenge–from his description, I imagine that Dr. Metropolis on, say, Kaiju Island, would be much like Aquaman on land–not necessarily useless, but lacking access to most of his powers. Maintaining that flavor while still making him equally viable in all environments could be tough.
I'm not too worried about Johnny Rocket (aside from his apparent lack of personality). If you looked at the mechanics of all of Tachyon's cards without the titles or flavor text, very little about her screams "speedster." I'm more concerned about Captain Thunder not looking like Legacy with Tempest's attack cards thrown in.
I find when I'm working on a custom deck (I do a lot of that?), I want to have a theme and/or a mechanic in mind first. Then develop it from there. To keep Captain Thunder from being like Legacy, find a mechanic or theme that fits him well and use that. Legacy was one of the first decks, so his mechanic isn't super-amazing, but his theme is about support and tanking, with some damage thrown on top. Captain Thunder will have all the years of previous deck building experience to help come up with a mechanic there, and all the backstory for a theme.
There are a bunch of different ways to view any particular theme or ability. In RPGS, speedsters can be designed by actually having a high speed attribute or by having abilities that act much like having a high speed would, but without actually increasing that speed (Area attacks representing punching all the things, high movement (not the same as high speed as they can't take more actions per round), improved accuracy, improved defenses, etc.
Hopefully this helps shed a little light on how Captain Thunder can be like Legacy without being like Legacy.
Legacy, Haka, Tempest, Ra, and probably a few others could be pretty easily slotted into each other’s decks with some damage type changes and a flavor reskin.
Finding unique mechanics to attach to less than unique powersets is not going to be difficult, I think. Sentinels has plenty of design space remaining.
Spiff, based off his statements from before, I believe Oblivaeon is pretty much done. If they are planning to have it in our hands by august, this most likely means playtesting and such must be done for the 3-4 months production process.
Yes, that does seem like a logical conclusion to make.
Also those of you who are looking for more story updates, they just posted an update on the earth prime kickstarter.
I'm interested to see if the story updates change anyone's mind. I mean, I'm coming at this as someone who's played M&M once or twice, long, long ago, so I really don't know anything about the characters, villains or settings of the books. I mean, that first update was pretty cool, right? :)
I guess? It mentioned a lot of heroes I don't know anything about so, at least for me, I doubt it had the coolness impact they wanted. Telling me about the big events when I'm not sure why I should care about the people involved yet is a tough way to get at it.
I'm at the $1 pledge level myself, and honestly all they need to do to push me over the edge is show these characters are more than just stereotypes. Christopher is designing the decks, and I assume we will be playtesting them, so I'm not worried about mechanics at all, not uniqueness or anything, the mechanics are going to be good, because everyone from the designer to the playtesters is going to make sure of that.
I just want to know that the characters are ones I want to tell stories about. If the characters are close to as good as the ones in SotM, I'll probably be getting the RPG stuff too.
I mean the characters always have been a huge drawing point for me, and especially how the decks tell us the story of the heroes, personality and style, it's a fantastic system. The letters page has been like when you find out something about a person you've known for years, and all of a sudden so much more about them makes sense. I don't want to water down the story of my games with weak characters.
Agreed with Spiff. We have a bunch of events that describe what happened to a whole lot of characters. Without knowing who a single one of those characters is, this is empty filler.
We did learn that the game includes Star Knight II, not Star Knight III, so add another modestly-dressed woman to the count.
I feel like some people need to recognize and get over the fact that they aren’t the target audience. They’ve almost doubled their funding goal and have hit multiple stretch goals without you and they obviously aren’t going to meet your ridiculous standards (that I’m pretty sure the original SOTM release wouldn’t have satisfied either), so is it really worth pissing and moaning about how terrible of a job they are doing every step of the way despite all evidence to the contrary?
I liked the latest update and hope to get more updates on the individual heroes and villains.
Christopher is a tad behind with OblivAeon so he got to finish that first. He wants it ready to be shown for the Gen con so there is a timetable. He also said he wanted to have some prototypes for the RPG by then so the Kickstarter can happen. I fell bad for the Tactics people, not a clue when they are getting time.
Christopher got many plates spinning. I doubt he would get burn out on any one. He did jump in on Spirit Island and helped out, and was he part of elder sign? He might get burned out for doing so much. Take a Vacation Christopher! but only after you get me some RPG stuff to play test. . .
I think the clothing the Heroes/Villians wear should be telling of their Character. I am all for titillation but for a game there I would play for hours it better have some substance behind the pretty picture. Even though Nightmist is covered head to toe and made of mist I still find her to be the sexiest hero is Sentinels. . . can't get enough of 1920 crime noir look.
Whoa there, man. I'm sure you didn't mean to sound as rude as you did, but there's nothing for us to get over. The people here are exactly the target audience for this product. These forumgoers are tabletop gamers who have a demonstrated enthusiasm for superhero themed card games, including Sentinels of the Multiverse, the game their game is based on. You can't get any more targeted than that. So what the people here are pissing and moaning about should be important to the people who want to sell product to them, which is why we're doing the pissing and moaning. The fact that every single person doesn't share our concerns isn't the point. These concerns are going to keep wallets in pockets, which is the opposite (presumably) of what the SoEP want, so hopefully they're listening.
[color=green]There is absolutely no problem with having differing opinions. However, the words used MUST show respect for all people involved in the discussion.[/color]
[color=green]If this type of wording continues, this thread will be locked and the discussion terminated.[/color]
People complained there wasn’t enough lore. It was pointed out that there is actually much more lore available for M&M than there was for SOTM when it first launched.
Several people quickly switched their complaints to the weight of their existing SOTM collection and not being able to play the many decks they already own or not having the funds to throw at a game they weren’t sold on. Those are all very legitimate reasons to not buy the game, but then why not state those in the first place rather than blame Green Ronin for not meeting a standard that GtG wasn’t held to?
So within a week of launching they post a very broad history of the setting and now we’re back to complaining about the lore.
What do you want, a wall of text copied/pasted from the RPG source book describing every character in detail on day one? There is literally 4 weeks left, give them a chance to actually dole out the information.
The people on this forum are largely long time SOTM fans who own most/all the expansions and have a vested interest in the SOTM universe. For the most part those people are absolutely NOT the target audience. The target audience is the M&M community who may like the game (especially sliver that overlaps with us). The target audience is the tens of thousands of board gamers who don’t already own an extremely similar game. The target audience is the 15k pepole who already backed it, most of whom were not from this forum.
Green Ronin isn’t about to rewrite their entire setting, so those complaining about the lore are not the target audience. It’s not GR’s job to convince people with financial concerns to be fiscally irresponsible. They already have more backers than this entire forum/community (and probably 4-5 times the backers as members that are actually active in the forum).
We, by and large, are on the periphery of the target audience at best. Listening to a vocal minority is often not a solid business plan, especially when what’s expressed is almost entirely negative.
I hope this sounds less rude and better explains my position.
I think you're wrong on just about every point, but I don't think this is a good argument to get into, so I'll just say "oh, I get it now. Thanks for changing my mind" and leave it there.
I don’t need a wall of text for each character. A short paragraph or even a long sentence will do.
What do I know about the Bowman? He uses bows. Great. Very descriptive, totally sells me on the character.
What do I know about Raven or half the heroes included? Next to nothing.
You say we aren’t a target audience, and yet they make it a point to note how it works with our current collection.
Collaborations tend to work both ways. M&M vets get to try a new game and be introduced to >G, and vice versa.
Given the popularity of the Cauldron decks, there really is no reason not to sell to us. But we need to be interested in these characters first.
I think the update misses the point entirely. One basic rule of storytelling is show, don't tell. This is even more true in comics than it is in novels. So I didn't even bother to read the wall of text.
This is a card game on comic hero characters, based on the gameplay of an established game.
At the very least, they should have started the kickstarter with 2 example cards, a short gameplay explanation (for non SotM players), and some quality art properly showing the characters.
So far, zero example cards, no gameplay explanation, and uneven quality arts with no comments on which of those style/artists will be used, or whether multiple artists will draw the cards.
This kickstarter seems to rely heavily on existing M&M and SotM players to just go with it and trust all will be OK. I funded a game in a similar situation where I loved the original but heavily disliked the "sequel" so, as much as I'd love to get more Chris cards, I'm probably not funding this kickstarter.
Yeah, I think Sentinels players and fans are definitely part of the target audience.
That said I think we'll see more information about the heroes and villains and environments that will be in the core boxed set as the kickstarter progresses. There's plenty of time for updates to answer questions and concerns.
That said
Captain Thunder is similar to Legacy + having lightning powers. He gained his powers while flying through a hurricane, after multiple lightning bolts struck the cockpit. His role is as senior statesman and leader of the Freedom League.
Daedalus is an immortal inventor - literally the mythical figure as in Daedalus and Icarus - who fights crime in an Iron Man-like battlesuit
Dr. Metropolis is basically the avatar of Freedom City, and I think the closest any character from comics comes is Jack Hawksmoor of Stormwatch/Authority.
Johnny Rocket is a speedster, and the grandchild of the original Johnny Rocket (the powers skipped a generation). Also, Johnny's another gay speedster, which I only mention because Tachyon's a lesbian.
Lady Liberty is a legacy character, going back to the American Revolutionary War. That is there have been several women who have been empowered by the Spirit of Liberty and taken up the mantle. This is of course not quite the same kind of legacy as Legacy, since they're not typically related. On Earth-Prime, one Lady Liberty was the inspiration for the Statue of Liberty.
Pseudo is an alien, formerly a citizen of the Grue Unity, an interstellar empire that was planning to invade Earth. Grue came to Earth to warn humanity and joined the Freedom League to help fight off the invasion. He was originally a scout and infiltrator intended to prepare the way for the Grue Unity to invade other civilizations, but his time among humans taught him compassion and empathy.
Raven is a second-generation superhero. Her father was the original Raven, although he retired from superheroing to raise a family. When his daughter was kidnapped by his own father, Dr. Sin, he reassumed the mantle of Raven and set out to rescue her. His daughter, post-rescue, decided she wanted to take on his role as a crimefighter. She did this despite the fact that her father was against this.
Siren is empowered by a voudoun loa, Siren (yes an actual loa from the tradition), and has power over the sea and sea life. Basically, Siren wants to prove that humanity is worth saving, while apparently Baron Samedi feels differently. Each chose a representative to prove their case, and Siren (the heroine) was Siren (the loa's) choice.
Star Knight is a police officer who was recruited into an intersteller organization called the "Star Knights." They have more in common with the Green Lantern Corps than anything, although they have technologically advanced battlesuits rather than power rings.
I mean these aren't much just what I could come up with offhand.
Omega rules The Terminus. The Terminus is basically the end of all things, but it has elements similar to Jack Kirby's 4th World. From The Terminus Omega invades other worlds in order to basically annihilate them. One of his plots was to annihilate the "Omniverse" which is just the word for the multiverse in which Freedom City exists. Omega represents an existential threat to all life.
Farside City is a city on the dark side of the moon inhabited by humans with psionic powers. Yes this is kind of a take on the Inhumans, but it is its own thing as well.
Tartarus is what it says on the tin. Hades is in charge (the mythological Hades).
Freedom City is similar to Metropolis or Megalopolis, but has its own things too, that I am utterly failing to remember properly.
The Meta-Mind is the ruler of the Grue Unity and wants to subjugate basically everything.
Argo is an android that was designed to mimic superpowers, but during his encounter with the Freedom League was locked into having their powers and their powers only. This only leaves him overwhelmingly powerful (like, more powerful than Omega if you straight up compare the two) instead of potentially omnipotent.
You win.
This is what we were hoping for in the KS updates. And maybe a few snippets of the defining plot threads for the character. But as many have pointed out, many days to go for the campaign :)
I forgot Bowman - he's another legacy character, being the fourth Bowman, after his grandfather, his father, and the original Bowman's ward, Timothy Quinn. He ended up going to Claremont Academy for training. He graduated from Claremont and joined the Freedom League after the Grue invasion. He's apparently a natural leader (and was leader of the Claremont based team Next-Gen) and basically been training to be a hero his entire life.
Thanks Belle! While I may not pledge right now, your information on several characters has definitely increased my interest and may pledge by the end of the Campaign.
You're quite welcome! :)
Yeah, that's the stuff I was hoping for. I have to say, most of it sounds like a DC Comics copy/paste, but at least I feel like I understand the characters they're trying to sell me now.
I see 4 of those heroes who intrigue me enough to consider trying to pick them up as "replacement decks" if I don't end up backing/picking the game up: Lady Liberty, Daedelus, Siren, Dr Metropolis. They definitely seem closer to unique archetypes.
We're still missing a teleporter.
Here, here! 
Best. Power. Ever.
I will agree though what Belle typed out should have been on the kickstarter page day 1 and then updates should have expanded on it. We will see where it goes but for me I backed it as another Sentinels Expansion set in another part of the multiverse.
Vanish (a teleporter) was the deck that got me really into Matthew Bishop's Cauldron. I'd still love to see Christopher make a Teleporter, but Vanish is one of my favorite decks outside of his decks, and I would suggest it to anyone looking for a teleporter, and hey, GtG now gets a cut.
I think a big part of the struggle to embrace this game will be the amount of crossover, even if the story and deck mechanics are different, I wouldn't play Batman and the Wraith together, even though I like both characters. I wouldn't want Captain America or Superman with Legacy. So I can understand the struggle to embrace those characters.
There are other characters, Bowman, Dr. Metropolis, etc. that don't have similar characters in the SotM moterial that we will gravitate toward. I do like that the gods in this lore are the greek gods, because there isn't direct overlap with SotM, where I don't believe any greek or roman mythology is involved.
I have gotten annoyed with the Kickstarter comments that are essentially demanding a months worth of updates to be available right now, and want the game to be almost complete. We need to have some patience. Green Ronin was targetting this game at their audience, and I think they underestimated the GtG fans interest. This is clearly a Kickstarter project that was started at the point right before significant resources would be invested to further the game, and not what a lot of people seem to be expecting, which is a kickstarter that starts when the game is almost finished. Just have to have patience. I backed at the $1 level for that reason, I have a lot of interest, but I'm not convinced I want to buy it. (I'm about 90% sure I will end up forking over the money, and about 10% toward backing for the RPG stuff too) Hopefully they are equipped to handle this kickstarter process in a way that will make the decision easier for everyone. But really, we need to have patience and let them catch up.
Yes, thanks. Just what I was looking for. I'm now much more interested.
I agree, except that I think "should have been" is unnecessarily inflammatory, particularly in the context of some people having voiced distaste for how Green Ronin has been called to task. "Could have usefully/helpfully been" is better, I think.
Just to throw my 2c in:
I plan to back Sentinels of Earth Prime. Payday is Tuesday, so I have to wait till then.
I (obviously) like Sentinels of the Multiverse. The prospect of having more Sentinels game play, even if it's not affiliated directly with the SotM universe, excites me.
I don't really care for Mutants and Masterminds. I'm ambivalent on the game system itself (it does "generic supers" very well, but falls down when trying to ape any specific era or sub-genre) and I'm not familiar enough with the setting to care about the characters. Plus, the last Mutants and Masterminds game I played--technically DC Heroes, using the M&M 3e rules-set--was maybe the worst roleplaying game I'd ever sat down to play.
I trust Steve Kenson. He's a legend amongst rpg designers and a stand-up guy all around. His other supers game, ICONS, is my favorite Silver Age style supers game.
I trust Christopher Badell. I've enjoyed Sentinels since my first play, back at Origins so many years ago. I have full faith that he and his crew will deliver a satisfying climax with OblivAeon and I eagerly await the Sentinels RPG.
What do I want to see? I'd like to see some general design notes: how is Bowman going to differ from Expatriette, in terms of "shock arrow/bullets, ice arrow/bullets, fire arrow/bullets"? What does Lady Liberty bring to the table? What mechanics are being experimented with, which we haven't seen before?
Do I want to see card mock-ups? Of course, but that's expecting way too much. I'd love just as much a "designer notes" section, where Christopher and Steve talk about translating a given character from d20 to SotM.
On the topic of double-standards for what content was desired for deciding whether or not to purchase SotM vs. what content is being voiced as desired/necessary for deciding whether or not to purchase SoEP, I think a significant difference is that the core game for SotM was not made available via Kickstarter. Anyone backing a SotM kickstarter for a later expansion would have had the opportunity to see that the decks from the previous SotM releases were of a certain quality, in terms of art, in terms of mechanics, in terms of story/character/style/feel.
As a SotM fan, but not familiar with M&M, I have confidence in the mechanics of the proposed SoEP decks, since Christopher is making them, but don't have much to go on in terms of judging the art, story, character, style, feel, etc. I _could_ go out and peruse a bunch (a whole bunch, I gather) of M&M Lore and art, but that would be both rather a lot of effort and also risk that whatever I find won't be a represenative slice of what will make it into _this_ game, into _this_ representation of these characters and places. So, instead, I'd like to see the Kickstarter campaign give me enough of a taste of these things to make a judgement about these sort of things.
If there are later Kickstarters for SoEP expansions, I don't think there will be the same strong need to see as much about the art, characters, story, etc. because people will have formed an opinion about whether or not decks from this game are the kind of thing they like.
On the topic of whether or not the people on this form represent a significant enough slice of the market for SoEP to be valuable to invest effort into: Interesting question! Around here I think it's easy to think that we're more important than we are -- many of us seem to be thinking about SotM all the time. I'm not sure, though, that we are either a particularly large slice of people interested in SotM or particularly representative of many people who are interested in SotM. Maybe, but I'm not so sure. Still, my guess is that it's worth Green Ronin's time to come here and start a conversation about what this community would be excited to see and support. I'm not sure why they haven't done that. My guess is that there's just too much to do and they simply can't do everything that would be cool.
Belle, that fount of information was well received over here, and definitely helps garner a bit more excitement. I admit, I've been a burgeoning fan of Siren since I saw her, and knowing even the basic foundation is a good step toward really liking or looking forward to any character!
i might just enjoy underwater themes in heroes. Man O' War was in my main team the first time through Freedom Force, with his sidekick close behind. Good times! I wish that cast could be playable in the SotM environs!
Might be of interest to some people here: https://freedom-city-claremont-academy.obsidianportal.com/characters
If I understand correctly, those are "character sheets" from a M&M campaign. Not 100% sure about the accuracy of everything (I know basically nothing about M&M), but the bios for the characters seem to line up pretty well with what have been presented so far... Something to chew on while Green Ronin is working on those updates! :)
Edit: I didn't found the source by myself, it has popped up a few times in the KS comment thread.
Thanks Belle! That was the information I wanted early on from the KS.
Earth-Prime is filled with homages to existing comic book characters, although I'm not sure how those characters are a straight up DC Comics copy/paste.
This is actually quite an interesting read… I can definitely see myself really enjoying these characters after some time with them.
Yes, I think these bios are helpful.
I think the kickstarter update misses the point entirely. One of the rules of storytelling is show, don't tell. This is even more true in comics than it is in novels, so I didn't even read the wall of text.
this is a card game for comic super heros based on the existing gameplay of SotM.
at the very least, the kickstarter should have begun with 2 example cards (even if not finalized), a short gameplay intro (for non SotM players), and a clear idea of what art style/quality/artist would be on the cards.
instead so far, no example cards, no gameplay explanation, and a very uneven quality of art with no explanation which style/quality will be used in the decks.
this kickstarter seems to heavily rely on existing M&M and SotM players to just trust all with be OK. I funded a similar situation before, where I loved the "original" but the "sequel" was awful. While I'd love to get more Chris cards, I doubt I will back this kickstarter.
I found a bunch of background information on a page here, this site seems to have a lot of stuff.
https://www.atomicthinktank.com/viewtopic.php?t=44786
Ah, the old Atomic Think Tank. I spent soooo much time there going through character build threads.
I created a heroic version of The Imprisoned Rogue that I thoroughly enjoy. I should check out Vanish to see how they compare…
Today's update is Bowman's bio.
I'm not sure how else they are going to tell the story of the characters other than the way they did. They apparently gave us several years worth of comic book history (in a few paragraphs) that is needed to understand the world, and thus the Freedom League and their members, a little better.
It's been a while since OblivAeon's campaign has ended, and we only finally got images of cards a few weeks ago. It's hard to demo a game that doesn't exist yet, AND they do have a link to a demo play of SotM in the first part of the campaign page.
I can't say anything for your past experiences, but if I've been given good products from certain people in the past, then I think it's not a stretch to give them some trust.
Anyway, today in the updates we've been given some of the backstory of the Freedom League's resident archer Bowman, so I hope you are happier with this update then you were with the previous one.
I'm honestly rather excited to get another archer character. I mean, all love for Parse, you don't play her because you want to shoot things with arrows. She's got better stuff to do with her time.
Also, can I just say how much I adore his name? Fletcher Beaumont, and he's an archer superhero. That is some grade-A classic comic book stuff. XD
Looking through everything added in this thread since update #3... it still seems a little lacking, story-wise.
Bowman III has been an archer/athlete all his life. He used to be the leader of a teen hero group, now he's in the Freedom League. But there's literally nothing else to him. (Incidentally, the whole Kickstarter update can be found on the Obsidian Portal character sheet and bio, so we can persumably read up on all the other heroes there as well.) However, we do get an idea of his mechanics from the Atomic Think Tank page, basically, gimmick arrows a la the comic book Green Arrow or the MCU Hawkeye.
Captain Thunder is apparently a statesman, despite being "Captain Thunder" full time, and a "family hero" similar to Legacy. I'm satisfied with the amount of background put into him. Mechanics will be tough, though.
Daedalus actually has a really thorough story. No complaints there at all. Mechanically, in addition to protection and strength, the suit comes with gravity-controlling powers and vision enhancements that let him see things on the atomic level and see through solid objects. Gold standard stuff here.
Dr. Metropolis is also all mechanics and no background/personality, he just sort of showed up one day and does what he does. The Atomic Think Tank character sheet even goes so far as to have him be severely weakened and eventually die outside a city. He's going to be a serious design challenge. Good luck Christopher!
Johnny Rocket: Another career superhero with no background or personality besides "fast" and the fact that he's gay. Yawn. He does seem to have some abilities centered around creating wind flow (e.g. tornadoes) with his speed, which will be a nice hook for Christopher.
Lady Liberty: Was in pre-law. Other than being very patriotic, that's pretty much all there is to know about her as a person. Power-wise, though, she has some potential: in addition to the usual flight and strength, she has healing powers and apparently some firework/explosion stuff. I guess she's probably the one Christopher mentioned in the podcast as having a shield that isn't documented anywhere.
Pseudo has a pretty thorough background, too. Good stuff on the Atomic page. Christopher will have both some espionage (mind-reading and becoming insubstanial) and shapechanging abilities to work with.
Siren is basically like Ra. Lots to work with here.
Star Knight: A former cop. Backstory is essentially a cross between the Green Lantern and agent J from Men in Black. I don't have a good feel for her abilities other than armor, flight, and an energy sword.
The Raven: Yet another career superhero with not much else in the way of background. She's basically the daughter of Batman, trained to be just like him. Making her different from Wraith is going to be a serious design challenge.
So to sum up, we have 5 heroes who are plain-vanilla and have not much background or life outside of being a superhero, two or three that are OK, and two or three that are pretty good. Mechanically, we have four or five that will be tough to make interesting, four or five that have some clear potential, and one that will undoubtedly be interesting but will be hard to reconcile with the lore in a way that makes sense and is fun.
So you're quivering with anticipation?
…Go to your room, UXM.
I think this is probably fairly accurate. I mean I wouldn't be surprised if they were already planning on putting up character bios prior to the responses, but I think the responses communicated just how important the background/story material is. And it really is a shift in perspective going from NPCs in a setting where player-created characters are the main characters to the NPCs themselves being the stars of the story.
Like I'm already sold obv. because I love both M&M and SotM, but I don't think anyone here should feel obligated to buy into it. I hope more people do and I think the end product will be worth it, but we'll see how things turn out.
I, for one, am someone who backed the Kickstarter so that I can augment Sentinels gameplay. I know nothing about M&M lore, but I also only have a vague idea of SotM lore, so that doesn't bother me. I look forward to more unique decks and new interactions between everything that already exist and will later exist.
I despise that quoting your post for truth breaks your lovely paragraph breaks, but I think this nails it.
I guess the disconnect for me is that all the backround we get via the Letters Page, etc., is extra as far as I'm concerned. It's great stuff, I mean, I'm eating it all up, but it's not the game. It's just the topping on what I already had and wanted. All the flavor I really need is "You (and your friends) are heroes working together to stop evil." And if someone's giving me even more heroes to be, and more evils to stop, I don't really care who they are at home so much as what they can do to stops evils. :B But then, I also like my pen-and-paper RPGs as video-gamey as possible -- none of this "group storytelling" nonsense, give me dice and XP -- so I'm probably the odd one out.
What I'm trying to say is, I will endeavor to be less confused and dismayed by the reaction to SOEP and instead try to enjoy discovering the new lore alongside those around here who haven't written it off yet. (Although I do feel it's worth mentioning Cauldron had like, zero lore until the final expansion was released and tosx started writing bios. Maybe it's not the same...)
I'm sure everything will work out fine. The kind of background we got for Bowman seems to scratch the itch that the story-first-ers have, and the people who don't really care about that stuff were fine already. Everyone's happy!
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the SoEP campaign has funded in less than a day. It is currently sitting on just shy of 75k$. A LOT of board game campaigns can't even hope to make that amount of money. Am I alone thinking this campaign is doing pretty much ok? I read a lot of complaining, probably justified in some case, but I feel like some people are exaggerating the gravity of the current situation...
Yes, OblivAeon made 1.5M$, but then it was the final installment of a 5 year old award winning game that MANY people had already played and loved... In retrospect, the Rook City KS made 27 880$, the Infernal Relics one made 111 258$ and Shattered Timelines gathered 185 200$. I honestly believe that SoEP is on the right track and I'm personally eager to see how the campaign will unfold!
I demand Adam Rebottaro does the art or I can't declare myself happy.
On another note, is it just my personal SotM bias, or the character description M&M gives sounds…bad:
" Bowman is cool, confident, and collected. He’s been training as a hero for as long as he can remember, so he really doesn’t know any other sort of life. He’s a natural leader with a take-charge attitude and a demeanor that commands respect. "
I can't remember reading anything that cheesy in a SotM hero description… or maybe it's just that I'm an adoptive american from europe so I find such descriptions as "cool, confident and collected" and "natural leader" profoundly ridiculous. Perhaps they should have added "Bowman, so hot right now". In fact, here's my contribution for the kickstarter art update:
The bio is from a sourcebook that came out like 11 years ago. Not sure if the new Freedom City sourcebook will have the same language.
Zoolander is from 16 years ago. That Bowman description was ridiculous 11 years ago as much as it is now. I understand what you're saying, it just does not reassure me much of the incoming quality (if different), if they feel it's OK to copy paste it as a kickstarter "update" : )
I don’t think the issue was ever if it would be successful but how successful. They have stretch goals up to $400k, and I’m sure having more of the almost 10k people tidy backed OblivAeon back this one would help.
I think a lot of the commotion that’s happened was because those of us that were critical of the lack of lore info were met with resistance from those who already bought in.
Now that they’re releasing the bios, the situation has more or less resolved.
TBH I don't really find it to be that bad. As far as using it as a kickstarter update, that's the text they have, so that's the text they used.
I think we're pretty spoiled by writing as SotM fans. Basically Christopher is like Al Ewing in a world full of Bendis.
It's enough to get you familiar with the basics of the character, so I think it works well. I think it's about the same length as the bios we have on the official SotM site, if I'm not mistaken.
I find this sentence to be very humourous, because as SotM fans, writing is the one thing we have the least of.
Seriously. All of the story related text that we have fits on the Wiki. All of it.
Christopher and Adam's stories are good, but I don't think that the stories are particularly amazing. Their true genius is in the way they've managed to convey those stories using a bare minimum of art, text, and rules. The delivery, rather than the content.
The level of story integration that SotM achieves will be difficult for SoEP because of the seperation between the design team (GtG) and the creative team (Green Ronin), but I am not particualrly worried.
There is, however, a danger of a self-fulfilling prophecy. This type of storytelling relies heavily on allowing the readers/players to fill in the gaps with their previous knowledge of comic book and general story tropes, and general imagination. If prejudice against the story causes people to refuse to fill the gaps that they filled while playing SotM, then they will find themselves dissatisfied with SoEP for completely avoidable reasons without ever noticing why.
I didn’t know anything about Mutants and Masterminds before now.
Learning these characters’ names has just made me appreciate even more how GREAT AT NAMING SUPERHEROES Christopher and Adam are.
I will agree with you there. I think some of the complaints though are more hey I want to back but I need a better total on shipping or hey the stretch goals order you have here doesnt make sense, aka the oversized villian cards being done 1 at a time, can we change it somehow into a pack of them.
Reading the Bowman bio and being sad at how little it actually tells us, I went back and read Haka's bio on the SotM website. The information we have about Haka is about the same amount, it's just really well written.
Most of what we know about him comes from other sources, cards, flavor text, things Adam and Christopher have said.
So I guess my big question for SoEP is will the flavor text be there, will comic issues be used in the flavor text? Are they going to give these characters a soul?
Because that is what I find with the SotM characters, they are engaging and feel real, like people I know. So I care about their stories.
This is a part I'm curious about too and I imagine for this the flavor text may be similar to what is on Environment cards or cards like Focused Aperatures and Null Point Callibration Unit
This, basically. It's not the quantity, Arcanist, it's the quality.
As someone who reads Marvel, I made the comparison because Ewing is very good at coming up with creative ideas, being very detailed and comprehensive in pulling those details together, and telling it in ways that are concise and interesting. Bendis, meanwhile, writes pretty typical comic stuff; fun but pretty bog standard, and decompressed for the trade.
So I guess I was trying to say in a pithy and humorous way (but obviously failed at that) that I don't think the problem is that Green Ronin's writing is bad; it's not, it's pretty typical superhero comic book writing. I think it's that Christopher's writing is that good, so "typical" looks underwhelming in comparison.
Of course, SoEP shares mechanisms with SotM but may not necessarily choose to share the method of storytelling (or card format, even). Remember Christopher designs the way each deck plays, but Green Ronin decides how they look.
So I posted a thing about how the RPG work in the Off topic area of the Forums. Anyone with any stories to tell about the RPG can you go there and post it? I am thinking about trying the RPG system just need some options.
https://greaterthangames.com/forum/topic/mutants-and-masterminds-rpg-10329
I think this is why I love SotM lore so much. Whenever I learn the story of a particular character, I can go through the art and see all the events. This is doubly true with the promos. Now that I know the Dark Watch story, I can look at the promos and see the meaning behind them.
This is one of my concerns for SoEP. There seems to be a lot of Legacy characters in SoEP, and, for example, I don't want the only Bowman promos to be the previous versions of him. A promo of him being the leader of Next-Gen would be cool.
Also, Captain Thunder bio is out.
Got antother update! This one is about Captain Thunder, and can be found here:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1780208966/sentinels-of-earth-prime/posts/1865259?ref=backer_project_update
Gah, corran ninja'd me.
You did the smart thing and linked it. I just made an off comment.
Captain Thunder mostly seems like Superman/Legacy but with lightning powers instead? I wonder if it's less straight forward in the details.
He's definitly got a different backstory from Legs and Supes.
He actually started out as a normal human and gained his powers through a freak accident caused by his soon to be nemesis, and when his career started he kept his identity secret.
I more meant in power set rather than backstory. It's not like Superman or Legacy have a similar backstory either.
No need to wait for the Kickstarter to add all these character backgrounds as updates. They're already on https://freedom-city-claremont-academy.obsidianportal.com/characters , so you can read them all there now.
Nice find! Thanks for the link.
The atomicthinktank link MigrantP put up in page 5 is a great source to find out about their poweset, if you read RPG fluently.
For example, what Captain Thunder's character sheet tells me is:
He has super strength, esp. lifting things.
He has flight, toughness and can sense electricity.
He heals when struck with lightning.
His primary attack seems to be a lightning bolt ranged attack, which means he is shooting the lightning and it is going distance and hitting a target, not Aeo or from clouds or anything. He also has a storm attack that does AoE, and an attack called Thunderstruck that disorients the target. (Xtreme!)
His melee attack is at +12, his ranged lightning attack at +13, so while is is better with lightning, he is almost equally equipped to fight hand to hand.
I just listened to a nice interview with Christopher on the Table for One podcast. They talk about a bunch of Sentinels things including SoEP.
http://boardgamersanonymous.com/table-for-one-episode-31-interview-with-christopher-badell-ft-sentinels-of-the-multiverse/
PSA: We just past 80000. On to the next variant.
Johnny Rocket update is up: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1780208966/sentinels-of-earth-prime/posts/1867418
And just like Johnny, you were way too fast for me again, corran! I'll have to be more prepared for the next update.
I'm finding it amusing that the Kickstarter comment section is calling this a failed campaign because it's not pulling in OblivAeon pace and that Green Ronin should consider "restructuring the product and relaunching" when they've already successfully funded.
(Well, assuming they get no more backers and half the funding group doesn't back out in the next three weeks)
I am not sure if thats what some are saying more as they are a little worried at how the stretch goals are laid out, especially the oversized villian cards and are worried we will only hit 2 of the oversized villian cards when there are 4.
goes and reads latest updates on the kickstarter page —>>> never mind bob. I see what you are talking about.
It is interesting that both speedsters from the card games (Johnny Rocket and Tachyon) are gay.
Someone actually did say this was a failed campaign and that Green Ronin should consider restructing the product and relaunching.
Some of the complaints about how successful the kickstarter is have been absurd. People want it to do as well as Oblivaeon and that is unlikely to happen. It's still doing really well.
Definitely doing well! Doubled the funding goal in under a week! Still over 3 weeks to go!
I'm assuming you've looked over the SoEP character list, do you have ideas already brewing in your head?
Yeah! Lots of cool stuff! Even stretch goals for the couple of people who only want the rulebooks! Cool beans!
(Dear Green Ronin, please give the backers Cool beans with this Kickstarter.)
I was a bit hyperbolic with my statement, but the consistent comparisons to how it's doing in comparison to OblivAeon and Sentinels bothers me. It feels like a standalone game that has integration potential is being treated as the next expansion, and thus those who are backing are giving it that expectation.
Yeah, someone on Reddit also did the whole "well, it's not doing as well as OblivAeon so they need to rethink their marketing" bit and then gave me a hard time when I pointed out that was not a constructive attitude.
I feel like some people are treating this as a threat/competition as opposed to a way to get more Sentinels stuff and bring more fans into the fold for both M&M and SotM.
While I don't think the Kicstarter should restructure, as it's already funded, I do think it could have started off on a better foot with some Sentinels fans. It's nice that we're getting the Bios now, but some description of the characters from the start would have pushed more people to backing it. With the way most Kickstarters work, it's a big push at the beginning and end, and I feel like it fell flat for some at the start. Hopefully more SotM fans return for the end of the project and back it.
I'm assuming you've looked over the SoEP character list, do you have ideas already brewing in your head?
I've actually been going over all the heroes, villains, and environments for about a year - we've been talking to Green Ronin on this plan for quite some time. I'm excited to share new designs with all of you... but OblivAeon first!
Hey, even Sentinels Digital Season 2 didn't do as well as Oblivaeon. That didn't mean it wasn't a success!
Also, I love the bit about their battle cry being, "Johnny, wait!"
Interestingly, that comment has a serious issue, as they're comparing apples to gorrilas.
OblivAeon’s Kickstarter was a completely different situation, the culmination of a story arc, combined with the box and all the options to buy everything ever, of course it was bigger. That’s simple logic.
Gah, you got me excited for so many things…I'm super eager to see what you've got so far for SoE-P, but I want OblivAeon done too! o_06
Actually, in some ways I think that they're better off where they are than if they had tapped into the OblivAeon pool.
I mean, there's no way that a couple extra hundred thousand in the Kickstarter would be a bad thing. But it means you're tapping into a different pool of supporters, and means different things for projections of future expansions. Because let's face it. No Sentinels card game product is going to do as well among the established Sentinels fanbase as OblivAeon ever again. Even if you ignore the marketing blitz OblivAeon had, and the "Everything Everer" pledge levels, the bottom line is that fans were starting to get expansion fatigue before OblivAeon, much less after. There's simply a point where you have enough deck combinations to keep you entertained until you die of old age, and the added value isn't worth $40 and another 10 pounds of cardboard. So after OblivAeon, it's all downhill. (and yes, I salute those of you who are determined to own every Sentinels card in existence, even the unofficial ones. But the majority of the base isn't going to)
On the other hand, if a brand new fan base can be engaged, one whose arms haven't given out yet from cardboard strain, then Sentinels of Earth Prime can gather momentum just like SotM did, until it's barrelling towards it's own million dollar final showdown.
Which is not to say that all of this couldn't happen if SoEP flew on the wings of established players. But if it's going to be as successful as SotM in the long run, new blood is needed. And all the established fans who decide not to back? They're still there - they can just as easily pick up the game after its published, having reassured themselves that Christopher's skills at designing cards have not suddenly evaporated since OblivAeon was defeated.
To be fair, the everything options combined only make up about 1/5 Oblivaeon's funding. The majority of the money came from the $109 and $139 options. A better comparison is # of backers, 9,982 vs 1,818 with the majority at the $40 tier. Maybe I overestimate the popularity of Cauldron-style additions, which is what many are treating it as, but I expected more SotM fans to be interested in SoEP.
hey Christopher. I would actually love to hear the designs a bit during the champaign not in the sense of being told exactly everything about a deck because you haven't played test it yet, but more from the stand point of a design aspect of your thought process in designing the deck. Especially for a character like johnny rocket where there is already a speedster out there with tachyon. So how will they play differently but still feel like a speedster. I want to see how your brain works when it comes to designing decks. It would actually be super interesting for future kickstarter updates as the game is being created if you could pick one deck to focus on with this aspect of why you made the changes you did or changed your thought process on something as a deck was built. Would be something interesting to see with several of the SoTM characters as well since you could easily tell this story from start to end now that the deck is out
Quoting enough for context to say that this is a really good post and I agree with it.
Yeah, I actually pointed all that out myself, but they weren't convinced by that either. 
Some people just really want to cling to unconstructive expectations.
I always thought the Sentinels community seemed really friendly and welcoming, but apparently it has a dark side too.
Also I too really like Arcanist Lupus' post.
I've read though it off and on but I just chalk it up to people having different expectations. I wouldn't call it darkness as I don't feel it's getting hostile yet but a continued argument with them doesn't seem likely to change their perspective.
Not everyone has the same point of view and disagreements will happen. That’s probably better for the community than 100% agreement all the time.
I 100% agree :).
Update for Star Knight is up!
...And I can't make a link because of my stupid work computer... X(
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1780208966/sentinels-of-earth-prime/posts/1868430
morph with the assist
But you beat me to it this time!
I'm curious how much the character backstories will show up in the cards.
Since Christopher is doing it, I assume they will. There are plenty of references to backstory in the SotM decks (eg, Ra as an archaelogist).
Christoper is doing the deck design and not the flavor text since he has stated it is not his story to tell.
I'm curious how that works out. For example, if Star Knight's police background will show up in card form, mechanics or otherwise. I'm assuming each card has to match its own flavor, so it'd be a back and forth between Christopher and Gren Ronin
The problem is that in this case the specific disagreements are leading to people being excessivly negative and giving unconstructive criticism.
I kinda wish people would understand the difference between constructive disagreement and unconstructive disagreement, and that there are an infinite multitude of reasons for criticising someone's point that don't involve merely not being able to handle that point disagreeing with you.
In this case: thinking a game isn't for you personally or saying you wish they'd provided more information earlier on or other marketing suggestions is constructive disagreement.
But thinking a project that was successfully overfunded within a couple days should still pull and relaunch it specifically following your marketing ideas because it didn't do as well as something that was the eagerly-expected end of a much-beloved storyline is unconstructive disagreement.
After reading the dr. Metropolis update, he is going to be interesting to see as a deck and how Christopher builds a character that feels like i am able to control and manipulate buildings
He seems like a liability unless you are in Metropolis so it is interesting to see how that plays out.
I went from being very supportive of the project to dropping my pledge. :(
Money's too tight, and unfortunately a couple of free promo cards doesn't feel like enough incentive to pay for the game now when I can order it this time next year.
Still wish Green Ronin the best and hope that they get to make everything they want (and more!)
Sorry to hear that.
Hope things pick up soon!
We are close to the next Stretch Goal, the Daedalus Variant card. by the look ofhow things are progressing, we should gett here in a day or two, if not sooner. :)
Thanks! Still can't wait to get it one day
They've revealed 4 new mini-expansion decks available as add-ons: the heroes Eldritch and Lantern Jack, the villain Malador the Mystic, and the environment Sub-Terra.
For some reason, each deck is $6, or $20 for all four. I'm not sure why the heroes and villain are $1 more, and the environment $2 more, than what >G sells theirs for. Even at 4/$20 it's more expensive than >G's MSRP by a buck, and that's not counting the shipping which we can't get estimates for. It's worth mentioning that they're using the same printer as >G, so costs should be the same.
However, it looks like they have something of an idea of what the art will be like, although they do say they're not final, they're at least confident enough to use these as placeholders. I was about to say that they have some idea of what their base powers will be, but then I looked more closely and saw that they both have the same power text, so probably not.
Didn't the price of paper go up recently in China? That could be the cause of the price boost.
Yeah that price increase for paper was mentioned for the reason of the price increase for Spirit Island. So a good chance this is related.
Then why a 50% price increase for the environment, and no increase at all for the core set?
Ask Green Ronin.
probably production run and wholesale. Printing the 300+ cards for a base set in one run would be cheaper than the 40ish cards for a mini expansion, which all ahve to be printed seperately and packaged seperately.
To answer questions about pricing, things like mini expansions with fewer cards are much more sensitive to price increases in materials. That is because 1) a mini-expansion uses less paper (about 1/14th as much paper as the core game), so you can't get as much of a bulk discount in order to help reduce the cost, and 2) assembling the core game is more labor intensive, so a higher percentage of the cost of the core game is labor.
To give you some data from our perspective, since we started printing mini-expansions, they have gone from a product with one of the best profit margins that we produce to a product with one of the worst. If we were to start selling mini-expansions right now, we'd price them at $6 or $7 a piece across the board (including environments, unfortunately, which feels wrong to me from a consumer perspective, but is accurate from a cost perspective). Hopefully the price of paper comes down, or we'll eventually have to alter our pricing strategy for mini-expansions in particular.
Interesting. I'm surprised mini-expansions are even on the table then. They sound like a bad deal for everyone involved. Most players who are willing to pay a premium price for a single deck are probably huge fans and would almost certainly rather spend more to get more. That might be different if this were, say, a D.C. Comics product (for which I can easily see someone really wanting that one specific deck), but for Multiverse/Earth-Prime I'm not sure it makes sense.
Since we have Rook City/Infernal Relics and Shattered Timelines/Wrath of the Cosmos as combined expansions, I wouldn't be surprised if we eventually saw a collection of Void Guard / mini expansions to round it out for people who haven't collected these expansions yet.
9 heroes and 4 villains / environments would almost provide as much value as the core game and could be playable on its own.
Would it make business sense to bundle the mini-expansions into sets similar to what Handelabra has ended up doing in for Sentinels Digital?
i.e., Mini-pack 1: Unity, Ambuscade, Silver Gulch
Mini-Pack 2: The Scholar, Miss Information, Final Wasteland
Mini-Pack 3: Guise, Wager Master, Omnitron-IV
Mini-Pack 4: Chokepoint, Celestial Tribunal, Stuntman & Benchmark when they come out
Void Guard set, with Champion Studios & Mordengrad if they don't end up bundled into the actual OblivAeon box themselves?
Great idea. Doesn't even have to be chronological - may make more sense if the bundling is informed by the relative popularity of the products. Or 'mix-n-match' bundles.
I don't think that's the case. I'm almost positive those are mini-expansions.
In the KS comments Chris Pramas has said how the stretch-goals post $100K were made to make the Over-sized cards more of a possibility, but he's seen the concern about if all of them are not unlocked. He's asking if making all of the oversized cards add-ons instead would be prefered.
I couldn't remember how they'd been announced, and didn't want to dig back through all of the monthly updates in order to figure it out.
Still, there's no comment from Paul right now, so it might be a moot point.
Void Guard was from a stretch-goal, Champion Studios and Mordengrad were "Sorry we're taking so long, here's some extra decks!" which we found out about from an update. Thinking about it the two enviros COULD be part of the OblivAeon box set, but I don't know if it's been announced as such anywhere. Not from what I've seen.
The environments are part of the OblivAeon box… they were first announced in Kickstarter update number 29 back in December.
Void Guard was a stretch goal, but they are definitely a mini-expansion and separate from OblivAeon.
Champion Studios, Maerynian Refuge, and Mordengrad were the environments announced with that so three environments not two.
Ah, okay. I got several Kickstarters going in my head right now, so I can't remember some of the finer details.
Chris Pramas has left this message in the comment section of the Kickstarter:
"We agree that it would be silly to have only some of the villains get the oversized cards. If we don't unlock them all during the campaign, we'll do one of the following: A) make the extras available through BackerKit after the fact, or B) simply commit to doing the rest anyway as a thank you for backing the Kickstarter."
Most Backers seem to be responding positivly to this, and are vying for the latter option.
Lastest update has some previews (not set in stone) of the Captain Thunder and Johnny Rocket character cards.
Art looks nice, very distinct from SotM, if a little harder to read. Captain Thunder's base power looks ridiculously powerful! I trust Christopher to balance him out, for the most part, but man, that's a hard place to start.
Update today had mock ups of 2 hero cards, Captain Thunder and Johnny Rocket, complete with powers.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1780208966/sentinels-of-earth-prime/posts/1881131
See how that goes over...
I for one like Thunder's power and can't wait to see the deck.
Putting those two side by side like that, Thunder's power seems objectively better than Rocket's in that it literally is Rocket's power plus some additional damage. Sux for Rocket.
Out of the 4 things the 2 cards allow you to do they have 1 in common, play a card. I don’t really see how that’s identical at all.
That being said, looking at them in a vacuum without their deck, yeah Thunder’s base power seems ridiculously strong even compared to most of the SOTM.
Oh, you're right. I thought they were both "play a card or draw a card", but I misread.
That power alone shows that Johnny's going to be well and truly different from Tachyon. I expect some crazy card play chaining. :)
Captain Thunder's power looks like it can really help out his team along with dolling out some damage.
Looking forward to seeing the rest of that deck to see how it’s balanced out. There aren’t many heroes who could get away with a power that strong without being overpowered.
FV Legacy has an equaly good power.
If I may theorize, Captain Thunder could have a few lightning combo cards that have normal effects if normally played, but then have greater effects if he has done any lightning damage durring his turn. That would be pretty cool.
I just noticed that the card mock-ups have their branding on them: Castle Comics. I wonder if, in the fictional world where Sentinel Comics is an actual publisher, is Castle Comics one of their competitors? That would explain why Multiverse/Earth-Prime crossovers are possible. I hope we get fictional publication history for Castle Comics. The one we have for for Sentinel Comics has always amused me greatly.
I noticed it too and doing a google search shows they've used the moniker of Castle Comics for a while in regards to Mutants and Masterminds.
We are very close to the end of the Campaign with 3 days left as of the moment I'm typing this.
We are over the 300% funding goal, and hopefully we get a nice big 'backer wave' when the last 48 hours hit!
Even still, looks like many of the stretch goals will remain unmet. It'll be interesting to see where Green Ronin and Handelabra go from there. We know they're probably going to go ahead and make the oversized Argo and Meta-Mind villain cards, but no word on the hero variant cards (Raven, Pseudo, and probably Lady Liberty--we should hit Johnny Rocket). Those are all fairly simple things, although art and playtesting are nontrivial; I'm guessing they really expected to reach those goals. Maybe they'll hold off on those promo cards for future kickstarters or whatever.
As for the video game, I'm really surprised the stretch goal for that was so high. Seems like a no-brainer for Handelabra, since they have the whole engine and all worked out already. It would almost certainly be a better use of their time than developing a new IP for themselves. It would be really surprising to me if they ultimately decided to just sit back and not do it, unless the card game tanks beyond belief.
Nothing says Handelabra won't do it still and they've made comments indicating they still are likely to. I think that stretch goal number was going to make more of a determination whether it was an immediate project for them once it's released or one down the road.
Agreed, but it seems weird to me that their estimate on if it would be worthwhile to make the game immedeately is an average of about 10,000 backers (assuming the majority are at the game-only level) when their own Kickstarter for Season 2 brought in about 3000 backers. I get a lot of people who play mobile-exclusive didn't back Season 2 because of the code distribution thing, but that number still feels off somewhere.
That's a good thought--maybe if the SoEP Kickstarter hit the $400k mark, they'd go ahead and develop it right away, but without that, they'll launch their own Kickstarter for it later on instead.
Most Kickstartrers have a good burst in the last 48 hours when people get their reminder emails. I think there's a chance it'll hit the $150k for the Lady Liberty promo. It's a bit of a long shot, but it's possible.
Alternatively, any promos that don't come out now might come out in the future as well.
Honestly, that had been bugging me, too. Especially as the Season Pass 2 KS raised less than 100K overall (not counting the mobile sales in the first, what was it, 48 hours?) SoEP has to be easier for them to code than OblivAeon or even Vengence, both of which are within season 2.
Honestly, I do hope we get an app version, as I honestly don't have the space. (I did back for the RPG PDFs)
The thing that is going to make it a lot more difficult is that they want it to be standalone and also compatible with SotM, even cross platform.
I would not any assumption on what would be easy to code especially since we don't know how any of these decks will work. Add on that they want to make it a standalone game. Really I just see 400K as showing there is enough of a player base to justify doing without a KS and as a more immediate project for them.
It's not guaranteed of course. But SoEP is meant as an entry level product, which means that it will be loaded with less complex heroes and villains. Looking at SotM, even AZ, the one complexity level 3 hero in the base game, uses only simple concepts even if his gameplay is tricky. The only unique effects in his deck are Isothermic Transducer and Subzero Atmosphere. That means that the vast majority of the effects will be things that are already in the Handelabra database, that they don't have to create new implementations for. The cross-game interaction is definately going to be tricky, but the code for the game itself should be quick.
I wonder if the delay on paying for shipping is skewing the total lower than it would otherwise be
I’d say that it’s more accurate to say that Kickstarters that include shipping skew their totals higher than they should be.
I just wanted to post and say that I finally found my Mutants and Masterminds book! :D I'm pretty sure it's first edition, so I have to wonder what's changed. They're releasing, what, 3rd ed soon?
(Also, where was it? Under my Aberrant book. I don't actually remember owning one of those. c.c)
3rd has been out for a while man.
looks things up
Holy crap! 
Since 2011. Time is rushing by at horrendous speeds.
The inexorable march of time waits for none.
Hey hey, Lady Liberty promo get.
We're in the last few hours of the Kickstarter campaign! So if anyone wants to get in on the action, now's the time!
Very close to that Meta-Mind oversized card!
Meta-Mind achieved, $160,000 broken (at nearly the last minute!). No Pseudo or Raven. Probably will get Argo anyway. And no short story.
And as we reach the end of the campaign, we raised a sum total of $160,103! Good work, all who contributed! Despite some bumps and grumps, for a new project's first Kickstarter I think this went exceptionally well, funding for just over 4 times the target goal!
Raven has "you may play a card" added to her base power. both Add-On heroes have: "One player may play a card or use a power" at the end of their power text, (even though they're likely to change to be differentiated a little more once they've actualy been designed)
I think this is more of a refining of Chris's ability to design hero decks. You feel more like a team with your friends if you can get and give extra card plays, power, or draws, and you feel like you can be more effective if the villain or environment has punishing abilities that destroys your stuff or keeps you from playing or doing damage. I think it allows the villains to be more powerful overall as well.
I bet the "additional power, draw, or play" on hero powers will continue to be a theme in many of the Earth-Prime hero decks. The actual cards will probably have to be a little weaker in comparison, but it's a good design choice imo.
The later sentinels decks and variants have a lot more of those extra play or power effects as well.