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Unity and the Relative Power of Heroes

33 posts · 1320 views · started 2015-02-09 19:23 UTC
PU
Pulseglazer
2015-02-09 19:23 UTC
#1

Note: All of this is for Advanced Mode.

 

Against the villains we have for the App, Unity is nuts.  There's a fair amount of different heroes being of different quality vs. the 5/7 (if we count alternates) villains we have, like Visionary being amazing against Dawn, Voss, and Baron Blade, but not having much to do with either version of Omnitron or Promo Blade. The same can largely be said for Absolute Zero against a villain with equipment destruction and a location that destroys equipment... or either Blade, the original which makes games go too quickly and the latter who destroys all of A/Z's stuff too effectively. Admittedly, these are extreme examples, but each also proves the point well.  Some others are always good, but usually dependent on their teams for how good (Legacy has less weight if your team includes Ra and Haka than if it does Tempest).  

Neither of these cases applies for Unity.  If you aren't nuts about Unity's own health, she will get set up.  Unless you have very bad luck with Swift Bot then, she will soon become a power house.  Once that's the case, she's capable of, within 3 turns, dealing like 15 damage per turn, of different types, to either 1 target or many, while also being able to nuke ongoings and enviornments or just make sure the nastier ones just hit the enemy.  This isn't the case in the full game, as several villains are anathema to her, constantly nailing and eliminating her bots, but for what we have now in the App, she's just nuts.  She rips apart everyone, in every setting that I've found, needing very little support (in fact, basically everyone offers her some sort of help).

Aside: If not for damage reduction, TLT would be right there... there are a TON of ways to mitigate that one weakness though - Twist the Ether, Alternate Bunker, Imbued Fire, Galvanize or Inspiring Presence, the Wagon or Obsidian Field.  Still, it is a weakness.

 

DO
Donner
2015-02-09 19:42 UTC
#2

Visionary loves Omnitron's Electro-Pulse Explosive.  Wrest the Minde + Telekinetic Cocoon = Nuke Omnitron.

PU
Pulseglazer
2015-02-09 20:13 UTC
#3

True but that's a very specific combo that you need to see.  I go a bunch of games, at least with base Omnitron, without seeing the E-P E.  And if I do, I need to have Wrest and the Cocoon all set and ready?  Not easy.

P2
Powerhound_2000
2015-02-09 20:16 UTC
#4

That only works if you let yourself get nuked by EPE for one round.  Though using Wrest the Mind on EPE is worth the damage Viz takes.  

P2
Powerhound_2000
2015-02-09 20:20 UTC
#5

Unity is mixed bag for me.  Some games she she gets a good set of bots out and contributes heavily, some game her bots just play fodder, and others I can't get a hand which is effective.  I don't feel in the current set in the video game that she is must have in the team against advanced villains. 

RA
Rabit
2015-02-09 20:22 UTC
#6

Or get a second card play. Somehow.

P2
Powerhound_2000
2015-02-09 20:25 UTC
#7

There isn't much of that in the game currently without Incapped hero abilities or Ruins of Atlantis.  Though you could get lucky with an Experiment from SST.  I'm not saying it can't happen but more that it's very unlikely.  

PU
Pulseglazer
2015-02-09 20:33 UTC
#8

So if I don't have Flash Forge or Swift right away, I either Brainstorm or Skip (plus 3 or 2 cards) until I see one.  I then, preferably, Flash Forge into Construction Pylon and Stealth Bot.  Once that's set up, it's really just playing the damagers as they come, preferably starting with Platform or Bee, heading to Chomps.  Once I get that initial set up, again, usually ready to start by turn 3 at latest, nothing in the current game seems able to stop him  without extremely bad luck.

P2
Powerhound_2000
2015-02-09 21:05 UTC
#9

I realize there are ways around it but to be effective I feel you need lucky/good draws with Unity.   It feels like I run into a lot of Unity coming late to the party and the majority of what was accomplished was getting a Bee Bot out.  I keep playing her more with the app though and hopefully I'll find a way I like playing Unity.  

PH
phantaskippy
2015-02-09 21:28 UTC
#10

I find very few villain deck shut down Unity, but there is bot killing (AoE or lowest HP) damage all over:

Ambuscade:  Flip side damage, Explosives Launcher, Charged Attacks, Sonic Mine, Unavoidable Explosive.

Baron Blade:  Consider the Price, Slash and Burn, Hasten Doom, Remote Powered Turret, Backlash Field, Devious Disruption.

Citizen Dawn:  Blinding Blast, Citizen Hammer, Citizen Assault, Citizen Blood, Citizen Winter.

Grand Warlord Voss:  Bionaut, Frosthound, Ion Lancer, Psy-Weaver, Conqueror, Stalwart.

Omnitron:  EPE, Sedative Flechettes.

 

Omnitron is the only one I generally have no trouble with, just the Flechettes, and Dawn rarely does enough to mess you up, but it happens, esp. on advanced with the increased damage.

The others you really have to work to keep them in play.

She is very comparable to Absolute Zero, because she is vulnerable to equipment destruction somewhat, and also all target damage.  It is nice when Bots save the heroes from lowest target damage.

 

KI
Killswitch
2015-02-09 21:33 UTC
#11

Argent is a good way to get out bots outside of her turn.

I've had pretty great games with Unity lately, despite my initial distaste for her fragile targets. Her hand resources aren't as big of a problem as the longevity of her bots, which are her key usefulness.

TW
twelveohone
2015-02-09 21:59 UTC
#12

I tend toa gree that she does remarkably well against the currrent digital villains, that said, she does have more off games then other heroes as well, due either to poor draws, or ill luck blowing out her bots.

DO
Donner
2015-02-09 22:12 UTC
#13

My friend who plays Unity a lot usually takes a few rounds just drawing two cards until he either gets some good bots or gets Flash Forge? and discards for the bots he wants.  Then he goes to town, playing Swift Bot first if possible and Stealth bot to keep Swift Bot up.

PH
phantaskippy
2015-02-09 22:40 UTC
#14

Which in games with 3 or 4 heroes can be the death of your team.

PU
Pulseglazer
2015-02-10 00:26 UTC
#15

With three maybe, but three is almost always kind of iffy, but of who we have now, who is beating you in that few turns?  Cosmitron with the right draw, I guess…

PH
phantaskippy
2015-02-10 03:40 UTC
#16

There are a lot of villains that you need a lot of impact int he first few rounds or you can get buried.  Having one hero draw two makes it really hard to get out of the early nastiness.

It's why despite her strength Unity isn't in the same category as a Wraith or Haka, because she needs team members to set the stage for her domination.  Not in giving her card play, but in terms of keeping the game winnable until she is ready to roll.

AM
Ameena
2015-02-10 11:07 UTC
#17

Although that said, giving her extra (ie out-of-turn) card play does really help with that a lot ;).

PU
Pulseglazer
2015-02-10 23:02 UTC
#18

While I don't disagree, who that we have in the core game is that true of? 

CH
Chaosmancer
2015-02-11 19:00 UTC
#19

 

Bomber Blade comes to mind. Not ony can he be brutal for Unity until he flips but you really need to hit him hard and fast.

 

Same with Voss with a H=4-5 or an unlucky draw on Dawn.

TW
twelveohone
2015-02-11 19:29 UTC
#20

Omni can do it too. To of the big bombs on turn one tends to demand a "right nao" sorta response.

DO
Donner
2015-02-11 21:02 UTC
#21

Voss at H = 4 or 5 can still allow Unity draw time if the others can fend off the minions.

NI
Nielzabub
2015-02-11 23:41 UTC
#22

It also depends which minions are out. The minions who target the Hero with the highest HP aren't usually a bit problem for Unity.

KR
kreistor
2015-02-13 22:03 UTC
#23

Unity suffers from "all hero targets" effects. They tear her bots apart, and few villains lack that capacity.

I have played a few games with Unity, but she has never been a powerhouse. Her bots are soft, get shredded fast, and with no self-healing, she does not fare well. If specific bots are in play at specific times... maybe. the biggest problem I have is her inability to get Bots into play. She gets locked up needing to destroy equipment, but has none. If the Unity player starts hitting the equipment of other players without permission... Unity would be put in the box for good. It's selfish, not co-op, to hurt friends to strengthen yourself. Maybe I just haven't been lucky enough to see her come out strong, so i will continue to give her a shot. (Whereas I will not give Chrono-ranger another shot, until a better Innate power becomes available to him.)

With either Omnitron-X or Absozero to help provide sacrificial equipment, she may get powerful... but why do that when Legacy would make both of the other two powerful instead? Legacy can divert the damage that might wreck O-X's components to himself, and his + damage has such an incredible effect on AZ it's hard to name another character that helps AZ more.

IMO, Unity is B, maybe B-.  Chrono-Ranger is F. O-X is A+, AZ is B on his own but A+ with the right team, and Legacy is always an A despite being boring.

DO
Donner
2015-02-13 22:35 UTC
#24

Omnitrom-X doesn't sacrifice components for Unity.  He makes her play the top card of her deck, including equipment-free golems.

BE
BerkMarc
2015-02-13 23:14 UTC
#25

I thought Chrono-Ranger was underpowered at first but he can actually be pretty devastating. If you can get out his hat with a Displaced Armory, he starts pumping out cards, many of which gives the change to do extra damage. He has two bounties that are really good and easy to get out. "By Any Means" increases everyone's damage by 1 to a single target without needing to use a power. "The Ultimate Target" increases damage for Chrono-Ranger against a single target but also lets him attack outside of his turn. Add in cards that do more damage based on how many bounties he has out and he puts up a good fight.

CH
Chaosmancer
2015-02-14 04:22 UTC
#26

 

I'd have to second BerkMarc. While DR truly destroys Chrono-Ranger his ability to just constantly ping people for 1 damage is great, and truly insane with a +1 or two in effect.

AL
Arcanist_Lupus
2015-02-14 05:32 UTC
#27

And CR has Masadah to deal with DR.  It's actually one of the only repeatable irreducible damage sources the heroes have (the others being Alternating Tiger Claw, Focused Plasma Cannon, and arguably Compulsion Cannister)

RE
Reckless
2015-02-14 05:41 UTC
#28

Maybe Chrono's promo (Promo-Ranger?) will provide a short term benefit for boosted damage?  Like "Bitter Quick Shot: Destroy a hero ongoing or equipment.  Chrono-Ranger deals a target 3 projectile damage."


 

Oh, wait…That already happened. :stuck_out_tongue:

BL
BlueHairedMeerkat
2015-02-14 12:41 UTC
#29

Oh ye gods, forget Dark Watch Fixer and think about Dark Watch Expat. Imagine Promo-Ranger with Aim.

AM
Ameena
2015-02-14 14:28 UTC
#30

I posted in another thread last night how insanely damaging Jim can get - if you're judging him by his base power without taking his other abilities into account, of course you're gonna think he's rubbish…but I suppose you'd think the same of, say, Fanatic as well (two plinks of one damage!). Like I said in my other post, on his own he can managed 3+3 to a target at least twice a round. That's not weak ;).

As for Unity, anything that lets her draw (or even better, play) more cards is good. Don't judge heroes by themselves - bear in mind they're always gonna be working in a team so don't think of it as "they can't do X", think of it as "so-and-so is in their team which means they can do Y".

P2
Powerhound_2000
2015-02-14 15:02 UTC
#31

I like Unity overall as she is always useful even in my bad draws.  I just don't find overpowered compared to any hero.   She has her downsides and upsides just like any hero.  

PH
phantaskippy
2015-02-14 18:02 UTC
#32

Omnitron-X, bleh.  he's great for villains that rely too heavily on ongoings or for just obliterating the environment deck, after that he's solid.

Crono-Ranger is going to end fights sooner than OX in most games.

 

It all depends on your playstyle.  I find Crono Ranger to be really strong, and O-X is mostly there to give extra card play and destroy ongoing/environment cards.  I'd rather have Adept or Tempest than OX.

O-X is a normal mode stomper, but I rarely play normal.

He's great with Unity though, Hasty->Defensive Blast is golden, and Timeshifting Unity is wonderful, I often put those two together vs. the Ennead for a stomp fest.

DO
Donner
2015-02-14 18:30 UTC
#33

My original ultimate 4-player team was Legacy, Tachyon, Omnitron-X and Tempest.

Omnitron-X and Legacy can tank.

Tempest and Tachyon and Omnitron-X can deal damage.

Tempest and Omnitron-X and Legacy can heal.

Omnitron-X would start with using his base ability to get Legacy set up.  Once Legacy was tanky, then he could focus on other people.  This team defeated every villain team on the first try except Voss and Akash'bhuta.  Akash pulled out all of her "play limbs" cards from just one of them entering play.  And Voss had a few too many forced deployments at once.

My new ultimate 4-player team is Argent Adept, The Scholar, Setback and Tachyon.  The Scholar goes Mortal Form to Energy x2 and Solid to Liquid x1 (with Bring What You Need in play).  He also gives everyone more card draws and plays and more power uses.  Argent Adept heals everyone, gives more card plays, and gives more power uses.  Setback gives healing, card draws, and power uses.  See where this is going?  Tachyon brings extra damage cancelation and more card draws.  However, most any other hero would work well in Tachyon's spot.  Except maybe Legacy.  He makes Setback hurt himself too much.