Completist question: Oversized Villain Cards

Hello!

I'm trying to understand the newest Oversized Villain Card product available for pre-order.

I have every card ever released from GTG for Sentinels.  I own the oversized villain cards from before they went out of print.  There are a few villains that do not have the oversized villain treatment.  I have not done an inventory, but I know there is at least one, and probably more, villains without oversized cards.  I loved that Vengeance included the oversized cards, but a promo villain along the way did not.

The listing for the new Villains expansion does not state if it contains oversized cards.  I wonder if GTG can clarify this.

Are any other completists out there ordering the $15 oversized villain pre-order?  I need to do an inventory to understand which villains do not have oversized cards, it might only be a couple promo villains, I do not recall off the top of my head.  I'm glad the pre-order window is rather large, so we can get clarification on subjects such as this.

The only villains without oversized cards atm are the Wrath of the Cosmos villains (Infinitor, Progeny, Deadline, Kagraa Warfang), the promos Agent of Gloom Spite and Skinwalker Gloomweaver and the mini-expansion Wager Master.

Villains is a Vengance style expansion so will have oversized cards.

It's currently unknown what the final expansion will be but it may include oversized villain cards as well.

Personally I'll be getting the new oversized cards and passing off my current ones to my brother who currently only has the base set.

I ... thought... I heard that there were Oversized cards in the works for Wrath villains, but they had been delayed at the printer and would be shipped out later.

I would too like to know this. If I am going to be getting Wrath Oversized, then there is no reason for me to order the Oversized villain pack.

https://greaterthangames.com/comment/94875#comment-94875

Aren't there also still a couple of open errata on the current oversized cards that are out there? I think that what a lot of people are after is the option to buy just the 'new' oversized cards (wotc, wager master, spite, gloomy, plus whatever the new mini expansion will be), but with a couple of errata replacement on top I doubt that it would be possible to offer them for much cheaper than $15 as >G would have to do a separate run on printing and packing just those cards (and potentially not selling all of that stock). It would be great if it was possible to do a separate extension pack, but if the difference is only going to be a few dollars then it isn't really an issue to buy the whole lot again.

My oversize pack has an old Matriarch errata, so beyond that I have no need to get everything else again. But I guess I can have backup copies..

There's an errata on The Dreamer too isn't there?

I guess the point I'm making is that there are eight missing Oversized cards and two (?) errata, so it works $1.50 per card if you only value the ones we don't have already. I don't think it would be appreciably cheaper to buy them separately.

Yes, the oversized card says she deals each hero H-1 psychic damage on her flipped side where the regular card gives it as H-2.

Actually, something else comes to mind - there could well be some more villain promo cards so for all we know there could be much more than 10 oversized cards that will be new to us!

This brings up a good point, though. Has there been confirmation that the typos have been corrected?

They wouldn't do another print run with well known typos still intact. I'd hazard to guess those are fixed.

I believe that there were oversized cards with errors for Citizen Dawn & Omnitron, as well - Dawn was missing the keyword Citizen on one side; I believe Omnitron was missing the Device keyword on one side.

Those were fixed on the newer cards. Not sure about La Capitan though.

OK. Since I got mine not straight from GtG (can't recall off-hand if it was through Noble Knight when I got my base set or from my FLGS later), I'm not sure where in the print run cycle mine come in. 

Check Omnitron or Citizen Dawn, if they have Device or Citizen in their keyword then you have the second printing, if they do not have those then you have the first.

I knew that part... I just couldn't recall off-hand which it was, and didn't want to go find the briefcase with the boxes and dig them out to check.

And don't forget La Capitan! She's supposed to redirect damage once per ROUND, not once per turn, on her flip side Advanced mode.

This thread has gone a bit off topic. I read the quoted posts, and I’m not any closer to an answer.

I thought Wrath of the Cosmos owners were being sent oversized villain cards at some point, but the quoted posts do not confirm that.

Is the consensus becoming that we should order the new oversized villain cards?

I wish GTG would answer us. I have been less than impressed with the new community manager.

That was a misunderstanding. People who are getting oversized cards are the people who have had them on order for months. They know who they are, and they've been emailed. If you didn't get an email, you're not getting them, and will need to order as usual if you want them.

>G are at Pax South right now, so it may be a little while before they are able to respond to stuff.

GtG has answered.  Very clearly.  If you look at the blog post in the comments section, the second post down from Paul, it says:

In order to get the new

If you didn't order the pack in the last year or so, you have to pay for it.  If you don't remember whether you did or not, did you get an email from Paul about it in the last week or so?  If not, you have to pay for it.

That is not clear at all, in regards to my question. At some point GTG promised to provide oversized villain cards to those of use who already purchased the base set. We got them with Vengeance, and it wasn’t until Wrath of the Cosmos and a few promos that the set became inomplete. Now, I am trying to understand why I have to re-purchase 10 or so villain cards in order to complete my set. It is frustrating. I don’t need doubles of something and pay for it twice.

Hopefully they can be treated as singles replacements or something. I don't want to have to buy another Legacy deck because one card is damaged.

Some of those 10 need replacing anyway, since they have errata.

So it appears the consensus is that we should order the new oversized villain cards, even if we bought the first oversized villain pack and every expansion and promo since release.

Sounds good. Please speak up if anyone hears otherwise!

Well, in addition to the new cards and errata, all of the cards are getting a design update. So, yes, get the pack.

Wait, what? I didn't see anything about a design update.  What is the update all about? Are we talking new artwork or moving text around or just a new border? Spill the beans!

I would imagine it's making them in the same format as the V5 cards, with the picture side by side with the text, rather than the text overlaying it.

I hope not… I kinda like having a big picture of the villain (even though it is partly covered by rule text).

I agree that I like the current format better than the Vengence format. I do like that the Vengence cards look different though as it makes them easy to separated from the other oversized villain cards. 

Yes, this will be the only way to get the new Oversized Villain Cards. Many of the old cards have slight wording changes to fix typos or errata, and they are all getting a slight graphic design update.

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It might just be that Jennifer is giving them a once over, but I do hope we can have a bit more clarity once they are back from Pax South.

Yeah, 'slight' doesn't make it sound like a huge overhaul, and the difference in orientation will make it a lot easier to tell who's Vengeance-stlye and who isn't when we have fifteen of these guys flying about.

Agreed. I like the smaller picture for "smaller" scale villain (Vengeance style) and big picture for big bad guys… Probably a psychological thing…!

Another thing is on the preorder page, they say it will also include "every villain which will ever be printed (other than those which come with their own oversized cards, such as the Vengeance villains)." Will that mean if more "big" villians appear as promos and future expansion, we get those cards too? That part confused me

It either means that there will be large character cards included with all future (standard format) villains, or that there are no future (standard format) villains. We aren’t quite sure which it is, yet.

Or maybe they already know all the villains they want to publish, and they'll just include them in this pack...and then we'll all just have to guess about their decks and when they'll come out for the next 15 years.

Not likely. You have no idea how much the character cards change over the course of playtesting. They wouldn't release the character cards before we've had a chance to playtest them, with the decks, and we definitely haven't done that.

Though there might be some promos for existing villains that don't have one yet and that don't have small cards yet.

Maybe they send it with any of the preordrs they recieve from the people with the oversized bundle thing

I'm bumping this thread because, although this group has come to some sort of conclusion, Greater than Games needs to give us feedback.

I'm a dissapointed fan, and I'm considering holding back on this preorder.  The community manager should at least talk to us.

Can you specify what you need clarification on? There have been several quotes of Paul in this thread that seemed to answer your question.

I'm quite curious what you would like clarification on that Paul hasn't already answered.

Will there be promo villains in the new oversize villain pack?

What are the changes to previous oversize villain cards in the new set of cards?

Will there be cards in the oversize villain pack that are for decks that have not yet been released?

The last question is just for my curiousity, but the first two have direct relevance on whether or not I want to buy the oversize villain pack.

Yes, "all" includes the promo cards.

The errata from older cards is being added, and there will be slight graphic design updates.

Yes.

And there you have it.

Apologies, my questions were not precise.

Will there be NEW promo villains in the new oversize villain pack?

What is the list of errata changes for the new oversize villain pack? Is it a couple of sentences on a couple of cards, or lots of sentences on lots of cards? How many cards are affected by the errata changes?

So far I've decided not to buy the oversized villain cards. I mostly don't use them, the errata seem to be few and well known, and there won't be very many new cards. But I'm on the cusp, as it would be nice to have a complete set and to not have to worry about remembering the errata. 

Perhaps the best way to ask my questions are:

How many cards will be in the new villain pack?

How many of those cards are analogous to previous cards, but with errata changes?

How many of those cards are completely new cards?

I'm not the OP, but I would guess he was still asking for a definitive answer on who needs to buy this vs getting a for free.  I understand it, but for crystal clear clarification, ordering Wrath of the Cosmos did not entitle you to the Oversized Villains, correct.?  The only folks who will get this pack without having to order/pay for it are those who had previously ordered it when it was out of stock and have been waiting for it for a long time?  I know it's been answered, but I think that will at least end the questions in the thread.

Post #4 and Post #20.

Man, you can tell you've been hanging around with Christopher a lot recently Please may I ask a couple of precisions on Andy's questions, which I think is closer to what people would actually like to know?

Will there be promo cards included that we have not seen before, in other words totally new and as yet unrevealed villain promos, or are we by default finished with all villain promos with what we have now?

What exactly does the graphic design update entail? Any chance of a sneek peak of what this will look like so that people can make an informed decision on their potential purchase?

When we say "cards for villain decks that have not yet been released" we are specifically talking about expansions (mini, regular, mega, or other) that will not be a part of (and therefore revealed at a later date than) this pre-order for Villains and it's accompanying mini-deck expansion has finished.

heh, ninja'd, but my precisions are still valid

When you say "oversized" cards, I assume we're talking about all dimensions here, right? I would like my oversized cards to be 20mm thick. Do they come with a pallet jack?

Buy enough packs and a case of high-quality paper glue, and you should be set (although some assembly is required).

No pallet jack, though. This is 2015 - we get hoverboards.

VERY interesting…

… or maybe not, as there is the Villain mini expansion that comes with the pre-order and which has not yet been released. Oh, the ambiguity…

Ok, we've reached the limit of what I can answer, as these are things in Christopher's mind. Unfortunately for me (and by extension, the forum), he is headed out to sail the seven seas currently. Once he gets back, hopefully he can shed some light.

He joined the Navy?

He got caught up in an annual geek migration. Luckily it's a short migration - they just loop right back again a week later…

Guess that means there won't be any preorder updates any time soon. 

Or will there…

Now that Craig, whom I presume is the community manager, has joined the conversation I am even more confused than before.  Can we get a more in depth reply to what a lot of customers are frustrated about?

Why have those whom have purchased every single bit of Sentinels been left to repurchase oversized villain cards?  Perhaps a clear explanation of the benefits of the new oversized pack will sell me and many others on it, instead of leaving us upset that we have cards that we purchased that are now worthless.

I'm not looking for forum members to answer this.  I'm interested in GtG staff.  Thanks!

The description of the oversized cards has been given multiple times now. Updated errata, a graphical update, and every villain ever to be produced. They are not a requirement to play the game, so the decision to purchase them remains with the purchaser.

Craig, I invite you to read this thread.  I'll link you to where it becomes most relevant to this post on GTG forums.

http://boardgamegeek.com/article/18159588#18159588

What we want you to understand, is that there is something odd going on here.  A LOT of fans, who have created GTG with our money, if you don't mind me saying so, were under the impression that the oversized villain cards would be part of the release of new villains.  Once you purchased the original base set, new villains would include oversized cards.

At some point, GTG decided this wouldn't happen.  I am not alone here.  There are many fans who thought this was the case.  I, and others, would like clarification from someone who has more information on the topic.  We feel like we're getting burned in some capacity.

Where did you get that impression?

It would be helpful if you had something from GtG specifically that states or gives the impression that they would give out Oversized villain cards for all releases.  I imagine they haven't said anything like that.

GTG has never said anything of the sort. If that assumption was put out there, it was just that: an assumption. GTG did say they originally wanted to do that, but that it wasn't cost effective to include it with the original set so once the game was successful enough, they decided to make them available.

I'm usually not one to put out strongly-worded posts, but - honestly - this pisses me off. I'm going to stop there, but because saying anything else is not going to be productive.

Short version: Just because we as a community makes an assumption, doesn't make it fact. GTG has never said anything of the sort. And if we hold something against them that we made up, it's our own fault.

You know what?  Forget it.  It's fine.  I'm trying to reach out to the Publisher of this awesome game, and tell them that quite a few people don't understand what is going on.  It is up to them to either reply, try to build a bridge, or simply ignore it.  I'm not interested in battling with an obviously passionate fan base.  That is an argument we all know who will win.  I'm simply going to withhold ordering this pre order.  I'm happy with the collection up to this point, and I'll move on.

Hmmmm.  A lot of strong emotions here. All I can say is that speaks to the strong bond that people have built with the game.  My personal experience has been that GtG has always delivered on my expectations. I know that in the past they offered an expansion of oversized cards that just had newly released villains. I know because I bought it. They may have lost money on that. I don't know. I do know that there is a lot of balls in the air right now. They may just not have time to do everything they want to.  At the end of the day I trust them to make something that I will enjoy. The oversized cards cost the price of an iMax movie ticket (at least where I live they do). If you don't think that you will get 2 hours of enjoyment out of them then don't buy them. If it costs as much as 2 tickets where you live then think of four hours and make the decision. I have already put my money down. Will I have some duplicate cards? Yes, but I am sure I will figure out how to put them to good use as prizes or gifts or even as decorations. 

Wow. All this fuss over something you don't even need to play the game, which has been perfectly well explained by multiple people multiple times.

Sound a little bit to me like complaining that you bought a Ford AwesomeMegaCar two years ago but now Ford's selling the AwesomeUltraMegaCar which has go-faster stripes, and they should totally send you a brand-new AwesomeUltraMegaCar because your older model doesn't have them.

Flouncequitting over something so trivial that I've managed to play perfectly well without for years seems somewhat childish, especially over something that someone who isn't a >G employee said. It reads very much like "The forum doesn't agree with me, so I'm not going to buy any more >G things! So there!"

I agree with you. I dont understand why people are getting mad over this. when a game gets a second edition or revised edition are they supposed to send you a copy of new version since you bought the first edition?

You know, sometimes you won't understand other peoples perspectives.  That's ok.  My point all along was that more than a few people were operating under a certain premise.

I have all my Sentinels stuff next to my office desk here at home.  I was browsing through it in the last hour or so, and I decided that I had to continue the collection.  GTG has made a beautiful product, and I'm not going to allow confusion over $15 ruin that.  So I preordered the Villains expansion and a pack of the oversized Villain cards.

I'm glad that's over.

I just realised what they could mean by the pack having cards for decks that have not yet been released. The villain mini expansion we get for pre-ordering VotM hasn't been released so it could very well be the one that meant, them being all cryptic about things.

Or we're going to playtest the NEXT expansion just after this one and get the villain cards to the place they need to be. Which is ridiculous, but HUGELY EXCITING if so.

You know what would be awesome, if you could buy the oversized cards individually through the replacement SotM card page in the store.

That is an excellent idea. That would entirely solve the problem people seem to be having.

I wonder how much they would have to charge for them, though.  I'd imagine shipping would be more than a single card because of the size/bendability.  Essentially, I would imagine the cost would approach just buying the pack

First, I'm very sorry that I posted emotionally. My sincerest apologies. (Probably doesn't help I've been sick for the past week. )

I have a feeling selling them individually (which I would LOVE ) would be cost prohibitive from a manufacturing standpoint. They'd probably have to handle it as they have in the past: By breaking open a full set (or using a defective/damaged set, if one was available) and pulling the card(s). If they're lucky, they'll have already broken open a set and someone would need a card that was still available, but that's even less likely with something like this where there are fewer cards available.

I'd be willing to bet manufacturing a small set of these cards to fill the gaps (i.e., cards that haven't been published yet and cards that have errata) is not going to be cost effective, given that they also have to print all the old ones, anyway, for new folks who didn't acquire the old print run. This is just a more cost-effective way to manage the need.

From a business standpoint, this makes sense; from a customer standpoint, it's frustrating.

I definitely understood your point, Bryan, and my response wasn't meant to be personal. My fundamental point was where that premise came from, that's all. I wish folks would think these things through instead of just assuming everything that's rumored is fact.

As a mod, my thanks to everyone for keeping this civil and honest.

While I’m with you on the subject, Rabit, I think this forum does have a tendency to run wild with rumor and can state something as fact when it hasn’t been confirmed. It’s always someone’s own responsibility to check their sources, granted, but this isn’t the first time there has been confusion in the ranks over “he said/she said,” and I doubt it will be the last! XD

Check your sources, folks! It’s just the neighborly thing to do!

I will just throw this out there as food for thought. I used to play magic the gathering. yes getting a bunch of duplicates of something is frustrating. but its nice to have when you need them. For example I had already bought infernal relics but since i was missing rook city I ended up buying rook city/infernal relics bundle. I just took all the old infernal relics cards and put them in their box and held on to them incase something ever happens to one of my regular ones I have an replacement. So just do that with the old oversized cards. If something gets damaged on the new one and the old one is the same just pull out the old one and dont have to worry about replacing it.

This gave me an interesting idea for a timed challenge… everyone should go check out my idea.