Couple Overcome questions

1) Under what conditions would a GM character have to make an Overcome roll? Heroes can't "make" Challenges, so what would they be overcoming?

2) Can an Overcome just be used to deal with something that arises in the fiction without it being a formal Challenge? For example, if a Twist reveals that civilians are trapped in a burning car, do the heroes just Overcome to save them? Is that a "fair" Twist on the GM's part, since it creates another (quasi-)Challenge for the scene?

My thoughts (which might differ from that of others ;-) --

1) There could be an environment overcome. For example, the GM might create a competition scenario in which both the heroes and villains are trying to get through a challenge, and whoever completes it first "wins". 

2) Definitely -- and you can "see" examples of this in some of the games GTG has put out. If I remember correctly, during the latest round that Adam ran, in the opening action scene at the funeral, there are examples of this. They might be pre-defined by the GM as twist options or they might be created on the spot by the GM and/or players as twists. 

1) The "Overcome" Action is much like a "skill check" in other systems (for instance, check out the Overcome Action in the Fate System). For the most part, SCRPG GMs are going to glaze over a lot of simple "skill checks" that you might do in other systems. The Overcome Action, for NPCs, is probably best used when the PCs do something (aside from Attacking) to stop NPCs, where the GM can see how well the NPCs can "Overcome" the PC's efforts. Here are some examples I can think of:

• A PC creates a wall of ice to stop a group of Minions from getting into the museum. The Minions can Overcome (probably, they want to get together to Boost one of them so that their Overcome has bonuses) to break through that wall.
• A PC wearing a Blade Battalion outfit infiltrates one of Baron Blade's bases. The enemies might make an Overcome action to see through the disguise.
• The PCs install a series of security systems because they're afraid of ninjas attacking in the night. The ninjas can Overcome to bypass the security system.

Could these be done with a PC Overcome action? Possibly! But I think NPC Overcome Actions are appropriate in the ice wall and the security system cases - the disguise case might be more appropriately done with PC Overcome actions.

Making all of this "feel fair" is probably a matter of balancing how many actions by one side can cancel out a number of actions by the other. If the PC takes one Overcome Action (to create the ice wall) and it occupies several Minion actions (to break it), then that might be a good reward for the PC thinking creatively or otherwise playing in a way that's good for the story.

Note to self: Encourage my PCs to use Overcome actions creatively to change the scene, and reward them when they come up with nifty ideas that make the scenes more interesting.

2) Again, "Overcome" is basically a "skill check." Overcome Actions don't have to be part of a Challenge, but Challenges are an organized way to set up Overcome Actions. But I've had the Environment create obstacles to Overcome (innocents being in danger, other changes in environment that are hurting the PCs), and I definitely would encourage my PCs to use Overcome to do things like persuade NPCs, repair a supercomputer, or find a magical ritual to seal a dimensional rift.

Anyway, in the rules, a suggestion for a Twist is "Create a Challenge" (Chapter 5, page 215), so this is perfectly within the rules, which might mean it's "fair." But "fair" is probably more about whether it "feels fair" to the players, which is going to depend on a lot of other factors in the game and the scene. :-)

This is helpful.  As someone who never grooved to FATE, AW, or Cortex, this game seems to take some of those ideas and make them more "traditional" (I'm from the 1st generation of RPGs).  Sometimes it just seems to be a matter of language.

I remain excited to work with this.  I'm still concerned about a few things, but I think I need to get it to the table before worrying about those.

I was thinking about this and had a follow-up question (sorry for the double post).

I can see how the rules could allow a hero to use an Overcome to essentially create a Challenge for a GM character.  But in terms of game balance, if that requires the GM character to do one - or more - Overcomes to eliminate, why would you ever use Hinder? At least in combat, it seems an Overcome can't (should't be allowed to?) create a Challenge.  The "ice wall to block the door" seems like it should just be a Hinder.

Does this seem right?

Why would I use Hinder? Well, Hinder can't spawn additional minions or Lieutenants to attack me. Or cause me to lose health, or take a likely large penalty. In any cases where my Players make an Overcome that I feel would create a challenge, we either delay the scene tracker by a round or untick a box as appropriate.

From a mechanical viewpoint, I wouldn't say putting up a wall would create a challenge. I'd say it's a Defend instead.

The system is flexible, so I just want to reward my players for acting creatively with their power set (in ways that tell comic book stories). But I also don't have to worry about my players just coming up with Overcome actions every turn to try and game the system - that's not how they play. As the GM, I also don't have to allow an Overcome to create an "NPC Challenge" - I don't have to let the player dictate the result of the Overcome at all.

But Overcome could give GMs an option to let players get very creative with their powers to create effects outside of Hinder/Boost/Defend. Why do this? Because it's always good to have a way to reward player creativity. But if you don't like this idea, don't use it. :-D 

But also: "Why would I use Hinder?" - Because Hinder works automatically as long as I get any result above 0. So does Defend. Overcome doesn't work cleanly until I get an 8. That's not easy-peasy! Sure, a player could first set up a bonus, then use Overcome, and try to power-game the system somehow. My suggestion would just be, "Don't let them." :-)